A Question About Funding in the COGOP

[dawgs10]

The reality is that what it means to support missionaries on the field (ie what Paul does) and what the cogop does are two different things.

it is not about us or them it is about accountability and return for investment

funds going to headquarters from churches that are struggling to exist while HQ continues to practice totalitarian tactics to control pastors and churches using unwise measures, frivolous and questionable spending etc.

When harvest partner support goes up for a region I believe the support from the GHQ goes down to balance the expenditures from Them.

Nations who were birthed on the prayer, sweat and blood of generations past should at some point become self sufficient and send missionaries themselves

that is not the case in the COGOP all of our foreign nation churches are on welfare and many are receiving from more than just the cogop. supporting a regional presbyter or national office does not equate to supporting missions

seeming very bitter toward cogop. i will say this, cogop is good church with good people and anointed leaders. pray for them. every time you feel an urge to complain, pray. you will soon start feeling better about the church if you will do that. sounds simple dont it.

[paul]

In response to:

The reality is that what it means to support missionaries on the field (ie what Paul does) and what the cogop does are two different things.

I am not sure what all those differences are. I would hope we are all working toward the same thing and that is reaching the unreached for Christ and making the good news known around the world. I amsure we have different methodologies but the same purpose.

it is not about us or them it is about accountability and return for investment

Here is were my greatest concern is and why I believe that so many organizations are missing it and also why there is frustration in the ranks of pastors and churches toward missions.

Our whole concept of why we do what we do must be realigned with the scriptures and not man made made programs. As one who embraces the basic concept of the Word of Faith Message (not in its entirity) I am assused constantly of giving to get. Yet, that is what we have come to expect in missions. If we give to them they must produce what we think is right and correct. If you give to mission what are you expecting as a return.. Surely, tens of thousands of souls won to Christ, tens of thousands of souls deliverd from Islam, buddism, HInduism, from sickness and disease.. Food given to help those who are living on less than a dollar a day. Isn't that a return on our investment ?

As you mention accountability. that is a result of the relationship that I spoke of earlier. And what accountability do we speak of. Missions is changing very quickly. The beloved American Missionary is no longer as accepted as they once were. We no longer hold the attraction that we did in the past. The american church must reaize the shift that has taken place and begin to give to the nations with fewer strings attached and allow them to do what God is calling them to do.

It is no loner feeasiable to go around the world and try to get countries to buy into the vision of a denominaton....That is why your funds are so misused....people on the field in these nations feel that they are being used to promote the vision of the organization. so in their mind if you want me to be a number for you then you pay for it.

Organizations must release the funds without these expectations and the Nationals must become more responsible and accountable to God in how they use the funds given them.

When harvest partner support goes up for a region I believe the support from the GHQ goes down to balance the expenditures from Them

.

I am not familiar with how cogop operates its expendutires to the nations so I cannot comment here. But I will answer from my method. If I am supporting the Philippines at $2,000 a month (example only) from the general account. A church come to me and says Paul, I want to send $500 to the Philippines a month..( for us that is completely a volentary decision ) It is sent to our office and then sent to the Philippines. That then releases $500 from the general account that I can send to Burma which I was only able to send $300 a month because of funds ( example).

Nations who were birthed on the prayer, sweat and blood of generations past should at some point become self sufficient and send missionaries themselves that is not the case in the COGOP all of our foreign nation churches are on welfare and many are receiving from more than just the cogop. supporting a regional presbyter or national office does not equate to supporting missions

I could write a book here but will refrain myself. Herein lies the problem. The church has approached missions from a Colonialism concept. Just as the spaniards, Britian, France and other nations did when the planted their flags in nations around the world. They claimed them, they are now their responsibility. They came and set up their form of government, tried to get the people to accept a foriegn lifestyle, language and so on. It lastes a few hundred years and brought nothing bur caos in the long run.

Now these major countries pulled out...to much money, fighting, wars etc.....but when they left they left anarcy. Countries who did not know how to geovern themselves. The riches of the land now depleted they were left in poverty. Still dependant. They were used only to show the strength of the conmquering naton.

Surely you see the comparrison. Denominations have operated in this method for decades. We plant our flag ( a figure of speach ) we take that nation for Christ ( in reality our organization) and we say look what we have done. Western m,issionaries tries to get the people to accept a foriegn lifestyle ( american culture) learn our language and jump to our tune why we hold the much needed money over their heads as a treat given to a dog that does a good trick for us.

Now that our economy is struggeling churches want to pull out of mission to varing degrees. And we leave them completely on their own with no means of support. If we had been using our funds to build their hopes and dreams, helping them reach the vision God had given them for building the kingdom and reaching souls for Christ and not building the reputation and size of our organizations we would not even be having this conversation. they would have become self sufficient long ago. It did not work in the natural and had to be abandoned. It will no longer work in the church.

So what are we to do... Start doing it the right way now. Find God called men and women around the world, invest in their dreams and visions, walk alongd side of them given them the tools they need to get the job done. Stop worring about the name over the door and building numbers for the inage of the organization and build God's kingdom.

Suggestion: If you still have your Oct and march mission drives, your wmb second sunday program? excellerate it, IO revamp their method of sowing into individuals and rather begin to sow into the dreams and visions of capable oversees leaders who WANT to be a part of your organization.

The begin to use your Harvest partners program and direct it to Missions in America. Where larger churches take on the load to help small strugeling church.

God knows there are hundereds of different methods available.....Get a task force inplace to explore what options are avaialbe. But don't stop giving to missions.

[Blended]

dawgs10 wrote:

seeming very bitter toward cogop.

Why is it that to question or criticize the status-quo or question the results of our programs we are suddenly perceived as bitter and against the church.

i will say this, cogop is good church with good people and anointed leaders.

where did I say bad church or bad people? I have not said it but I will say some of our leaders are power hungry and lords over Gods heritage I did not say all were.

pray for them.

Oh I pray That God will change our hearts to the true harvest and remove the spirit that has made of us spiritual gigolos. True missions that reach and care for the masses and not just support a hierarchy. Leaders who seek God for his purpose and plan and not just pronounce a blessing on their outdated and failing methods.

every time you feel an urge to complain, pray. you will soon start feeling better about the church if you will do that.

As A Member, Minister, Bishop of the church it is my responsibility to cry out for change when the spirit has been calling for our repentance. We have made verbal statements of acquiescence but are still using the same policies that are producing little for the kingdom. I feel great about the church I am sad about where it is heading, if we do not change, bankruptcy and dissolution.

sounds simple dont it.

simple is the word however I would not apply it here:shock:
but I will refrain from making this personal even though it seems that you were endeavoring to do so.

There are none so blind as they who will not see

Blended