The good ol' days

[dbserv]

completely.

This is what true WORSHIP is all about.

One service like this is much more meaningful and long lasting than all of the tongue talking services for a whole year combined.

[Kenya]

The lives of these people away from the church service did not conform to the life a Spirit-filled person would live.

And this is the point that needs to be made.

When we look at the Bible as a whole and the "big picture" message Christ brought to the world, the purpose of the Holy Spirit is not to label who speaks in tongues and who doesn't. The message is...are we exhibiting the Spirit of God in our lives where others can see the fruits and the gifts being manifested in us.

We have been caught up in the "tongues" aspect of this for way too long and it is holding up our progress of reaching the lost and encouraging the brethren.

[dbserv]

I agree completely! I am so WOWed to see the number of P/C churches, ministers, members who are coming to that realization.

I am also WOWed by the number of Baptist, Nazarene, etc. churches that have dropped their condemnation of tongues and accept it as a bonafide expression of the Holy Spirit in people's lives.

It maybe hasn't happened at the denomination level for some of them, but HEY COGOP hasn't made changes at the denomination level that actually took place some time ago and is currently taking place.

As one who was "independent" from 1982 - 2002, I see the opposites coming closer and closer together on so many doctrinal issues - tongue talking, once saved, etc. I am amazed to watch the Lord's Hand at work.

I believe that a lot of the hands on work of the HS was done, and is being done, through Promise Keepers, Women of Faith, and other organizations that reach the people at the opposite ends of Christian doctrines. They bring us together to WORSHIP, and like you and Brenda have pointed out, it's amazing what God can do when we enter His Courts!!!

[dbserv]

I couldn't have said it better.

I struggled with this issue for over 10 years after leaving COGOP before the Spirit finally opened my eyes to the fact that THEY ARE FILLED!!!

God bless!!!

[Pastor Bill]

Michael, I agree with you, that that makes it seem that many we consider great leaders of the past were not Baptised in the spirit according to P/C doctrine, but what conclusion can we draw from that, I don't think it is mearly throwing out the doctrine, but we need to strive to understand it more.

1. They were not Baptised in the HG, but God was still able to use them in mighty ways (just as OT examples)

OR

2. They were Baptised, spoke in tonges, but it was never reported or recorded in any way because it wasn't seen as important compaired to other works God had used them in.

OR

3. They were Baptised without any evidence. Is there anywhere where the Bible says evidence is required?

As for using other signs for evidence, I am not comfortable with that, because there is no biblical presidence for it, the only gift refered to as being used for a sign is tongues, the only gift present in all instances of baptism of the HG in scriptures was tongues, the only example of the early church seeing the evidence and pointing it out was tongues.

Do people fake tongues, YES, does that mean that real people don't really see God move in this way for real, NO. Judging all who speak in tongues by those that fake (an act that I think would be a very spiritually dangerous thing, but that's another topic) would be no different than judging all Catholics by the actions of the priests who have been accused of child molesting, or judging all Muslims by the events of 9/11. Let's not go there.

[lacipage]

What a topic...
Well honestly we all know that it is we ourselves that keep God from doing a work in our church and our town and in our own lives. We keep ourselves in a box looking at our watches waiting for 12:00 to hit so that we can go home to our usual mundane lives, I am also at fault sometimes!

What is wrong with getting back to the "Heart of Worship" and finding out what God really wants to do. It is only when our all in all is given that Revival will truly return to our heart and Church.

[Ephesian]

Psalms 144:11-15

Rid me, and deliver me from the hand of strange children, whose mouth speaketh vanity, and their right hand [is] a right hand of falsehood:

That our sons [may be] as plants grown up in their youth; [that] our daughters [may be] as corner stones, polished [after] the similitude of a palace:

[That] our garners [may be] full, affording all manner of store: [that] our sheep may bring forth thousands and ten thousands in our streets:

[That] our oxen [may be] strong to labour; [that there be] no breaking in, nor going out; that [there be] no complaining in our streets.

Happy [is that] people, that is in such a case: [yea], happy [is that] people, whose God [is] the LORD.