Beach Day at Church

[Paully_44]

I am sooooooooooo glad I'm free!!! All I got to say!

Sometimes bondage and entanglements with sin and the world come in the guise of liberty.

And many times bondage and entanglements come in bold-face legalism.

[Ilovebigcats]

Non-biblical extremes are extremes either way. The person has a responsibility for themselves -- not to be an offense or stumbling-block to others AND also not to permit, entertain, or yield to any impure thoughts or motives of our own.

We are to make no provision for the flesh -- both our's and other's (when it is in our power to do so).

Pshh... so, I have to cover up all skin because someone has a deep issue with lust!? Hogwash! Some men are OVERLY attracted to FAT. So should I lose weight to not be stumbling block? What about the men that like skinny women? Then I suppose I shouldnt walk around alive in front of serial killer. Please!!!!!!!! Get delivered from the lust issues and sexual overload because of the legalism and be FREE!

You can't justify a personal problem by dumping it off on others as being a stumbling block. You tick me off.. so are you a stumbling block for me or should I learn to deal with the nonsense you spew because I was once blinded by legalism too. Hmmm..

[Pastor Gary]

Some men are OVERLY attracted to FAT. So should I lose weight to not be stumbling block?

Hey -- have you been watching "More to Love?" That show is a chubby-chaser's fantasy, I am told. And yes, some men really prefer bigger women. I first became aware of that when the black men i my Army unit saw my 95-pound bride and were amazed that I found her attractive because there was "no meat on her bones." They would go absolutely insane when a 200-300 pound, shall we say "full-figured" woman walked by.

Get delivered from the lust issues and sexual overload because of the legalism...

I believe you have just struck a nerve with that one. I grew up in the days when we had to wear long jeans to camp in August lest someone see a 15-year-old's calf muscle and explode with lust. Not only was "mixed swimming" not allowed, they built a massive solid wooden fence around the pool so nobody could sneak a peek of flesh. All that did was create a forbidden fruit effect that made boys risk life, limb and expulsion to get near that fence, try to peek through a crack and get a brief glimpse of pasty-white, pudgy, teen-age girl skin. A lot of damage was done by those attitudes. A LOT. It created a generation of repressed males who got excited at the sight of anything remotely looking like girl-skin.

I got past it. Others did. Apparently not everyone.

[Poimen]

I have no more battle with the temptation to lust than any other normal man -- be he a believer or not. So quit the misdirection, ad-hominem, and smokescreen. If the truth hurts then do something about it. If our hearts condemn us GOD is greater than our hearts.

Excuse it, down play it, and repackage it all you want guys.... the BOOK still says make NO provision for the flesh. The BOOK still says to dress MODESTLY and with SHAMEFACEDNESS. The BOOK still says to look out not only for ourselves but for others. It still says walk WORTHY. It still says be holy in ALL MANNER of conversation. It still says to be SEPERATE, UNSPOTTED, BLAMELESS< and above REPROACH.

Be mad at me, shocked at me, ridicule me, put me down, called me old fashioned, legalistic, judgmental, or whatever. I can take it. But let the word of the Lord change your hearts and bring you away from such shameful practices, acceptance, and immunity to sensuality and wickedness.

In Christian love and brotherly concern.

[free]

So we're all wroing and Poimen is correct...The scripture is true, few find it!

[Pastor Gary]

Excuse it, down play it, and repackage it all you want guys.... the BOOK still says make NO provision for the flesh. The BOOK still says to dress MODESTLY and with SHAMEFACEDNESS. The BOOK still says to look out not only for ourselves but for others. It still says walk WORTHY. It still says be holy in ALL MANNER of conversation. It still says to be SEPERATE, UNSPOTTED, BLAMELESS< and above REPROACH.

And every one of those terms cited is relative. The BOOK doesn't define precisely what is or is not modest in a given situation.

In a room full of naked people, the guy wearing a fig leaf is the modest guy.

[Ilovebigcats]

Get delivered from the lust issues and sexual overload because of the legalism...

I believe you have just struck a nerve with that one. I grew up in the days when we had to wear long jeans to camp in August lest someone see a 15-year-old's calf muscle and explode with lust. Not only was "mixed swimming" not allowed, they built a massive solid wooden fence around the pool so nobody could sneak a peek of flesh. All that did was create a forbidden fruit effect that made boys risk life, limb and expulsion to get near that fence, try to peek through a crack and get a brief glimpse of pasty-white, pudgy, teen-age girl skin. A lot of damage was done by those attitudes. A LOT. It created a generation of repressed males who got excited at the sight of anything remotely looking like girl-skin.

I got past it. Others did. Apparently not everyone.

I completely agree! We had a hard time with that.. just women wearing spaghetti straps to church flipped us out! Once we got past the initial shock.. I never even notice it. I am not staring people down lusting after them because I am so hidden from skin. That isn't a seared conscious.. that is freedom from lust and legalism.

We go to the lake all the time. It is more humorous to look around than lusty. lol That teaching brought such an illusion of something risque that isn't even there. Now yes.. there are some flaunty people.. but when YOU no longer have the issue, you can just overlook them for what they are.

And besides that.. there is NOTHING wrong with looking at someone and thinking they look good!

BTW.. no I haven't seen More to Love... but I do know what you are talking about. I have a HUGE aunt that always has some skinny boyfriend cause he likes 'em BIG. Yuck. Whatever floats your boat.

[Ilovebigcats]

I have no more battle with the temptation to lust than any other normal man -- be he a believer or not.

I don't believe it for a second.

Go read the modest scriptures to the poor naked kids of this world who don't have the 3 piece suits you wear...

Your definition of modesty is based on legalism.

[Poimen]

I have no more battle with the temptation to lust than any other normal man -- be he a believer or not.

I don't believe it for a second.

And it doesn't matter what you believe about it, because God and I know the truth.

Go read the modest scriptures to the poor naked kids of this world who don't have the 3 piece suits you wear...

I don't wear, nor do I own, a 3 piece suit. And as far as preaching to the naked kids (or adults) I will. But I will also do as the Lord said, and when I see them naked I will clothe them.

Your definition of modesty is based on legalism.

No, it's based on decency, common sense, and Biblical principle -- shamefacedness to be precise. The lack of shame or embarrassment at exposing one's self or form is proof of failure to let our attire be worn with modesty and shamefacedness.

[paul]

I have no more battle with the temptation to lust than any other normal man -- be he a believer or not.

I don't believe it for a second.

Go read the modest scriptures to the poor naked kids of this world who don't have the 3 piece suits you wear...

Your definition of modesty is based on legalism.

I love your request..... I have prayed for so many women who were in front of me breast hanging and a little baby working it for all the child could get.

I just keep praying, does not bother me any more. At first I had a problem. Not a lust problem, just what do I do when she grabs my hand and plants in on her breast and ask for prayer. Has happened several times. I pray and move on.

We have polaced so much emphisis ( wrongly) on the body, that in our country every thing is seen in a lustful manner. It really is a shame.

[EagerBeaver]

I have no more battle with the temptation to lust than any other normal man -- be he a believer or not.

I don't believe it for a second.

Go read the modest scriptures to the poor naked kids of this world who don't have the 3 piece suits you wear...

Your definition of modesty is based on legalism.

We have placed so much emphisis (wrongly) on the body, that in our country every thing is seen in a lustful manner. It really is a shame.

AMEN times 850.

[RamboPreacher]

....
No, it's based on my personal convictions and interpretations of decency, common sense, and Biblical principle -- shamefacedness to be precise. The lack of shame or embarrassment at exposing one's self or form is proof of failure to let our attire be worn with modesty and shamefacedness.

fixed for clarity

[Paully_44]

I love your request..... I have prayed for so many women who were in front of me breast hanging and a little baby working it for all the child could get.
.....

We have polaced so much emphisis ( wrongly) on the body, that in our country every thing is seen in a lustful manner. It really is a shame.

I spoke with a missionary friend who travels to Peru at least twice a year and says he encounters the same thing. Too bad they dont know they not dressing in a modest manner.

[Pastor Gary]

I love your request..... I have prayed for so many women who were in front of me breast hanging and a little baby working it for all the child could get.

Saw something similar on that trip I made to the Philippines. We visited these Compassion centers at churches and met, literally, hundreds of young mothers at each, toddlers in tow, baby in arms. As we made our way among them, more than a few had a nursing baby attached to their breast as they smiled, shook our hands and graciously welcomed us.

[oletimer]

Pastor Gary Posted:

Ilovebigcats wrote:
Some men are OVERLY attracted to FAT. So should I lose weight to not be stumbling block?

Hey -- have you been watching "More to Love?" That show is a chubby-chaser's fantasy, I am told. And yes, some men really prefer bigger women. I first became aware of that when the black men i my Army unit saw my 95-pound bride and were amazed that I found her attractive because there was "no meat on her bones." They would go absolutely insane when a 200-300 pound, shall we say "full-figured" woman walked by.

I WOULDN'T TOUCH THAT ONE WITH TEN FOOT POLE!!! NO WAY, ON WAY,

Ilovebigcats wrote:
Get delivered from the lust issues and sexual overload because of the legalism...

I believe you have just struck a nerve with that one. I grew up in the days when we had to wear long jeans to camp in August lest someone see a 15-year-old's calf muscle and explode with lust. Not only was "mixed swimming" not allowed, they built a massive solid wooden fence around the pool so nobody could sneak a peek of flesh. All that did was create a forbidden fruit effect that made boys risk life, limb and expulsion to get near that fence, try to peek through a crack and get a brief glimpse of pasty-white, pudgy, teen-age girl skin. A lot of damage was done by those attitudes. A LOT. It created a generation of repressed males who got excited at the sight of anything remotely looking like girl-skin.

I got past it. Others did. Apparently not everyone.

I guess God should get over Adam and Eve, because what He told them in the garden was very much legalism, ask Adam what he thinks about it now. All the "thy shall do" and the "thy shall not do". Our whole lives involves legalism in some fashion or another. The only true freedom that man has is the freedom to choose right or wrong, as the way (not ways) of God or the ways of Satan.

The very things that I hear many say as legalism and narrow minded now are some of the very things that cost men and women their lives in the days of the the Children of Israel. I believe that most of it was listed as idolatry. I know some want like this statement, but check it out or get over it.

How sad it for some that don't even know the Lord or are having a problem with their own life tying to straighten out those that are tying to live and do right and have a good relationship with God.

When we talk of modesty, and then to it you want to say we need to wrap her with fifty foot of clothes, as to make little of the situation, when you know that you are wrong in doing it. Someone wrote of the woman at the well having bed clothes wraped around her then at least she was decent.

Decent is really what this should have been about, but many want to make excuses so they want have to make adjustments in their lives or at least this the feeling that I'm getting. I think of John baptizing there at Jordan, when the people came to be baptized and John saw that things weren't right he told them to bring forth fruits meet for repentance. Now I'm not saying that that lady hearts wasn't right, I think that she was ignorant to the fact. But really at this point its not any longer about her as much as ALL of our conflicting veiws. You think that I've have legalized to bondage, and I think that you have liberalized out of the will of God in many cases. Will it be too late, might be for some.

Mt 3:7
¶ But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Mt 3:8
Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:
Mt 3:9
And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

There is one thing that I have learned about the Pharisees and Sadducees is that they not only were legalistic, but that they also changed God word around to suit their sorry ways. Didn't make it right.