The Debtor is Slave to the Lender

[Russell Roberts]

The aggregate national debt is over $34,000 for every man, woman, and child in the United States. Sadly, this generation is selling its children into slavery. Please don't add to the problem by living above your means. Want to see the debt our children will inherit? Here's the link.

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

[beckrl]

The aggregate national debt is over $34,000 for every man, woman, and child in the United States. Sadly, this generation is selling its children into slavery. Please don't add to the problem by living above your means. Want to see the debt our children will inherit? Here's the link.

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

What I'm a poor white man

[Paully_44]

The estimated population of the United States is 305,294,703
so each citizen's share of this debt is $34,836.16.

so what is the share for those living in this country who are not legal citizens?

[Tim Elston]

so what is the share for those living in this country who are not legal citizens?

That's a good question, although we should realize that the tax dollars that are going toward our national debt are going primarily towards interest, not principle. So, in reality, since our debt principle keeps rising instead of going down the share for every citizen is infinite, not some $34K. And, in reality, this infinity should not be sliced per citizen but per tax payer.

[Russell Roberts]

so what is the share for those living in this country who are not legal citizens?

That's a good question, although we should realize that the tax dollars that are going toward our national debt are going primarily towards interest, not principle. So, in reality, since our debt principle keeps rising instead of going down the share for every citizen is infinite, not some $34K. And, in reality, this infinity should not be sliced per citizen but per tax payer.

Thanks for the comments Tim. Though the picture is pretty bleak, that really brings it home. Maybe it's high time the U.S. thought about a little international debt forgiveness. We will reap what we sow.

[Tim Elston]

Though the picture is pretty bleak, that really brings it home. Maybe it's high time the U.S. thought about a little international debt forgiveness. We will reap what we sow.

Good point, Russell. If we factor in our debt, I wonder whether we are the poorest country in the world. It would be interesting to calculate our national net worth and compare that to other countries. I'll admit, there's a part of me that wants comeuppance to come to us. We think we are so great, but there is a little thing called economic law that is going to bite us. And neither Republican nor Democratic constituents have the political will to start reducing our principal. Instead, we go blithely along paying hundreds of billions on interest and spending more like there's no tomorrow. When we fall, we deserve to fall so hard, it isn't even funny.

[Russell Roberts]

Nope. It isn't funny. It is very, very sad. Especially for our children and their children. It makes me wonder how how Elijah must have felt while praying for no rain and knowing the devastating consequences.

[bibleguy]

If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered.... The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs. The modern theory of the perpetuation of debt has drenched the earth with blood, and crushed its inhabitants under burdens ever accumulating

A lot of the blame rests firmly on Woodrow Wilson and the Congress in 1913, with the creation of the Federal Reserve System.

Constitutionally, Congress has the authority to print money. A great deal of our debt is to our own Central Bank. When they print money, that money comes with an interest cost. When the government gets $1M, they have to pay it back with interest money (that has not yet been printed).

Coupled with the promotion of a debt-based economy, we're all in hock.

And now that the Fed is out of control, they're going to print money at an alarming rate. (Can anyone say Weimar Republic?) The influx of printed currency without any collateral backing will decimate the value of the dollar.

It's a shame too. Our country is so rich in natural resources. If the Congress had power to print the money, it could back it up with our resources: oil, natural gas, precious metals, coal, forests, etc. Some valuation could be made, and allocate some as collateral, and print some money. Real money = real value. (Remember the silver and gold certificates?)

Check out the evolution of the money, since the Fed's formation. It used to be worth something. Now - it has no intinsic value. (The following Pictures are from www.perfecteconomy.com with a lot of interesting, important information.)


(I think the red was digitally enhanced, but I have seen this notation before.)

[bibleguy]

I love Joseph's method. He didn't believe in "bail-outs."

When the people ran out of money, they came to Joseph and said, "Give us bread: for why should we die in thy presence? for the money faileth" (Genesis 47:15).

Joseph's reply, “Give your cattle; and I will give you for your cattle, if money fail” (Genesis 47:16).

So they traded their herds, their flocks, their horses, their lands, their homes, and finally they sold themselves as slaves to Pharaoh - all worked out by Joseph. After this incident, all of the Egyptians were slaves to Pharaoh (Genesis 47:17-26).

(Mind you, a close read of this passage seems to show that the children of Israel were set up well in Goshen, and did not find themselves in the same predicament as the rest of the world. Therefore their enslavement came in a different way -- as described in the first chapter of Exodus)

Joseph knew nothing was free. They wanted bread for nothing, but his good stewardship of the nation's resources didn't end with the seven years of plenty. With Pharaoh's divinely inspired dream, interpreted by Joseph, Pharaoh's willingness to heed the warning and plan ahead ended in his enrichment.

Washington should be getting some Sunday School lessons.

[Full Quiver]

Andrew Jackson though he had some bad policies paid off the national debt and TRIED to eliminate paper money. He said paper money could be printed as needed but gold and silver coins were a real commodity. Too bad we didn't listen to him on that instead of kicking the Native Americans out of the south east.

[Tim Elston]

Andrew Jackson though he had some bad policies paid off the national debt and TRIED to eliminate paper money. He said paper money could be printed as needed but gold and silver coins were a real commodity. Too bad we didn't listen to him on that instead of kicking the Native Americans out of the south east.

Americans are not interested in fiscal responsibility. Ron Paul got less than 10% of the vote in most states. He was the only candidate who was serious about dealing responsibly with our debt and stopping the raping of America by the political-financial industry. Americans won't know what hit them, because they don't want to know.

[Tim Elston]

Another sobering thought is that debt from bank loans is the de facto creation of money out of thin air. Bank loans are in effect the printing of money that did not exist prior to the loan; only rather than printing it as currency it gets printed in a database. The more money there is, the less it is worth. That means that our collective bank loan debt reduces not only the value of our future labor, but also it reduces the value of our current money. In effect, for each dollar more we go into debt we reduce the value of all existing money by that dollar plus that dollar plus interest at the time it is paid off, divided by the value of all existing money. If x is the value of all existing money, then one dollar of debt results in

x - ((1+n)/x)

The 1 equals the value of the dollar today. The n equals the value of the dollar after interest at the time it is paid off, if ever. In other words, for every dollar we add to collective bank loan debt, we shoot ourselves in the foot today and in the foot and the leg and maybe the heart in the future, depending on how long it takes for that dollar to be paid back. And since we are not paying off our debt, but adding to it, as a matter of course, we are essentially shooting what's left of our foot today as the initial nuking of ourselves in the future.

[Pastor Gary]

Ron Paul got less than 10% of the vote in most states. He was the only candidate who was serious about dealing responsibly with our debt and stopping the raping of America by the political-financial industry.

There are several components to being an electable Presidential Candidate. Having sound fiscal policy positions is certainly one. Whether fair or not, a candidate must first pass the image test. Ron Paul doesn't look or sound Presidential. If he looked like a President, and didn't sound so whiny and annoying, he could have sold his ideas and might have been elected.

[RamboPreacher]

Obama was elected. I am waiting for my check to help pay mortgage and monthly bills. Isn't that what was promised? "change" can be interpreted lots of ways.

[Tim Elston]

There are several components to being an electable Presidential Candidate. Having sound fiscal policy positions is certainly one. Whether fair or not, a candidate must first pass the image test. Ron Paul doesn't look or sound Presidential. If he looked like a President, and didn't sound so whiny and annoying, he could have sold his ideas and might have been elected.

You're right, Gary. Ron Paul had image problems. That's my point. Americans, as humans, respond to image first, not substance.