sermon confirmation

[Full Quiver]

BTW, I heard a Baptist preacher on television earlier this evening preaching an almost identical sermon to my Sunday morning installment on "spiritual warfare and demons". I assume that was his Sunday morning sermon as well. It was a nice confirmation to an already confident direction

So if I preach that if you give all your money to me that God will bless you with a new car or a cancer free life AND I see some TV preacher say the same thing then that's godly confirmation and I'm safe?

Maybe, just maybe you two were reading the same book, other than the Bible, authored by some guys who wanted to make a buck off his opinion. Maybe you bought a sermon from the internet and so did the guy on TV.

[DeWayneTN]

This harassment of Pastorables is getting really old. If you don't agree with his theology, fine - free country - pray for him. But it sure would be nice to see a little more mercy, peace and love around these parts.

[Gerald Creasy]

This harassment of Pastorables is getting really old. If you don't agree with his theology, fine - free country - pray for him. But it sure would be nice to see a little more mercy, peace and love around these parts.

Conversely, It would be NOVEL to have a minister rise out of superstition and "mama said" rather than perpetuating the Biblical ignorance of previous generations.

[DeWayneTN]

Have you prayed for him?

[Gerald Creasy]

Have you prayed for him?

Well talking logic and reason to a man who believes in Demonic cats and the scriptural equivalence of a "multitude of councelors" hasn't worked so It looks like I'm gonna have to.

[paul]

This harassment of Pastorables is getting really old. If you don't agree with his theology, fine - free country - pray for him. But it sure would be nice to see a little more mercy, peace and love around these parts.

love, mercy, and peace rises out of a contrite heart.. Not one that is full of anger, hurt, bitterness, fear and rejection, and self-righetousness. Untl the heart changes that leapord will never change his spots.

[dolfan]

Alright, look. I know Pastor Ables. Know him. I know this guy. We have talked, shared, discussed, written, ummmm, emailed, voicemailed ... you name it. He's the one person on this board that I can say that I've met through J2 and have a relationship with on a consistent basis. In short, he's my friend. Now, he'd be the first to tell you that he and I are not of the same opinion about certain things when it comes to the faith. That's public here. But, I'll be the first to tell you that this guy is a genuine student of the Word and a pastor of people. I love to pick things apart on here, and to talk about why some things are treasures, why some things are trash and why some things are uncertain. All of it is just my opinion, just like everyone's opinion is his or hers. Mine has no particular weight to it over and above anyone's. We're all sort of describing the elephant based on where we stand in relation to it without knowing what the rest of the thing is like. God has revealed Himself to us sufficiently, fully and thoroughly, but not exhaustively because He is too great to know. Even the Bible itself is a finite disclosure. Sufficient for all matters of the faith? Yes. Do we know God completely by it? No. We see through a glass darkly, right?

Some things are just so out of whack with all of biblical knowledge, so unreasonable on their face that we justifiably and (again, IMO) hilariously and uproariously ridicule it. WOF, for example. But, some things that seem subjectively unreasonable to me I keep my mouth shut about. I don't know --- this other person may be right in a way that hasn't dawned on me yet. Probably not , but they might be. And, to put myself in a position of deciding that person's merit as a believer based on that? No! No, no, no. I can't allow that for me. There are some of you who may secretly, although in a kind way, do that to me! I'm the former pentecostal, the one who spoke in tongues, who believed and lived that whole thing to the hilt. I'm the one who changed. Do I regard my change as correct? Well, sure I do. But, do you regard me as having thrown away God's gift???? Boy, I hope not, at least not for that particular reason. And, I hope not for your sake because you don't know the pains of my heart and how I've walked to this point in my life. Likewise, I don't know that about how Ritchie Ables has walked to this point in his. Far be it from me, a person who knows this guy, to put myself in a position to judge his merit as a believer.

One of my former pastors once preached an outright error from the pulpit one Sunday morning. He was just dead wrong. A know-it-all guy came to me and said, "Will you go with me to ask Bro. So-and-so a question?". I did, just to accommodate the guy. I didn't know what he was going to do. Well, he confronted my pastor, my friend, my mentor at the time, with this error. He did it in a manner that suggested "I know more than you you old hick preacher." And, he was an old hick preacher then, and proud of it. He'd forgotten more Bible than the fellow confronting him ever knew or knows to this day. I told him right there I didn't like it and that it was unnecessary even if he was right on the technical point.

Now, I know what Gerald is fighting for here is not just technical. It is substantive and it goes deeply into the heart of the assumptions that underlie much pentecostal belief. He also fights here for people to lay aside preconceptions, earlier assumptions and to look freshly at the Scripture and consider things about eschatology since that shapes so much how believers act and live now. So, while I can't say I know Gerald, I can say I know by his writing what it is he's so moved and angered about. And, I can also say that I share his views biblically, at least I think I do --- I figure I'm probably 95% or better with Gerald on agreement about what the Bible teaches where I may be a bit less than that with many others here.

But, I'm just a guy. A guy with a friend named Ritchie Ables, a guy I know and love as a brother. And, you know, I don't like this scratching for a fight with him about the merit of his whole way of ministering based on his instinctive connection, an inner witness that I really can't argue with, to the stories of his grandmother and the long-time preaching about a one-world currency or what have you. I'm on record here as not agreeing with the validity of such ideas --- but I want to be on record here that there's absolutely no use in challenging the very core of the man's faith in Christ and his calling. To him, I think I'm right when I say that he believes he is called to do what he is doing, and that call is wrapped up in his whole relationship with God. How he goes about that, and how God communicates with him about that, and what ideas, stories and impressions God uses to inspire and move him to live that out is beyond the say-so of you or me.

[Gerald Creasy]

love, mercy, and peace rises out of a contrite heart.. Not one that is full of anger, hurt, bitterness, fear and rejection, and self-righetousness. Untl the heart changes that leapord will never change his spots.

Oh Lord! They're asking me to be accountable for what I preach!

*Great intake of air to match the puffed up heart* THEY must be full of bitternesss.

=================


No.

Just sick of idocy passing itself off as being from God.

[beckrl]

I've also heard a "sermon confirmation" told this way.

The pastor is setting in an Sunday School class before his morning service, and finds the teacher has outlined his whole message.

Would you view that as a Coincidence or Comfirmation?

I know for the minister it would be even harder, because he may feel everybody has already hear that message.

I know some may believe that is a confirmation where two agree on.
I also know we a times try to find the will of God and this maybe some type of way that we feel that God is leading us.

[paul]

love, mercy, and peace rises out of a contrite heart.. Not one that is full of anger, hurt, bitterness, fear and rejection, and self-righetousness. Untl the heart changes that leapord will never change his spots.

Oh Lord! They're asking me to be accountable for what I preach!

*Great intake of air to match the puffed up heart* THEY must be full of bitternesss.

=================


Eph 4:1 I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,
Eph 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love
Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
Eph 4:7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
Eph 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

Verse 14 is how you see everyone except yourself

Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

Verse 15 is what you fail to do

Eph 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

Verse 16 is the hinderence you cause.

Eph 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
Eph 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

In my oponion verses 17&18 are what you are guilty of.

Eph 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
Eph 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
Eph 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

All I can say of verse 29 is WOW !!!!!

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

[Gerald Creasy]

I've also heard a "sermon confirmation" told this way.

The pastor is setting in an Sunday School class before his morning service, and finds the teacher has outlined his whole message.

Would you view that as a Coincidence or Comfirmation?

I know for the minister it would be even harder, because he may feel everybody has already hear that message.

I know some may believe that is a confirmation where two agree on.
I also know we a times try to find the will of God and this maybe some type of way that we feel that God is leading us.

How far do you take it though?

When is it what an itching ear wants to hear and when is it "confirmation"??

Today I'm driving down the road and I'm listening to Mike Gallagher talk about North Carolina. I look up the truck in front of me has N C plates.
I chuckle and drive a mile or so down the road and realize the truck is going to the exact same store I am going to.

What does that "confirm"?



In Florida my brother lends me the car and I drive the short drive down to Clearwater beach and pull in to park. One car over is a Jefferson County (Louisville) car parked.

What does that confirm?


Yet again we are given ANOTHER EXTRA-BIBLICAL verification for TRUTH:

Creflo Dollar Preaches Jesus Was Not God (and he does).
I turn on the radio and theres ANOTHER idiot preaching Jesus Was not God.

Is this a confirmation?


I hear Joel Osteen preach about the power of WORDS and Marilyn "Talk to your wallet" Hickey says the same thing/

Confirmation?


COINCIDENCE molds the scripture.

That too is lunacy.

[Gerald Creasy]

love, mercy, and peace rises out of a contrite heart.. Not one that is full of anger, hurt, bitterness, fear and rejection, and self-righetousness. Untl the heart changes that leapord will never change his spots.

Oh Lord! They're asking me to be accountable for what I preach!

*Great intake of air to match the puffed up heart* THEY must be full of bitternesss.

=================


Eph 4:1 I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,
Eph 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love
Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
Eph 4:7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
Eph 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

Verse 14 is how you see everyone except yourself

Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

Verse 15 is what you fail to do

Eph 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

Verse 16 is the hinderence you cause.

Eph 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
Eph 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

In my oponion verses 17&18 are what you are guilty of.

Eph 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
Eph 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
Eph 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

All I can say of verse 29 is WOW !!!!!

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Lo the Whited Wall the Great Judge has spoken.

[paul]

love, mercy, and peace rises out of a contrite heart.. Not one that is full of anger, hurt, bitterness, fear and rejection, and self-righetousness. Untl the heart changes that leapord will never change his spots.

Oh Lord! They're asking me to be accountable for what I preach!

*Great intake of air to match the puffed up heart* THEY must be full of bitternesss.

=================


Eph 4:1 I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,
Eph 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love
Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
Eph 4:7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
Eph 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

Verse 14 is how you see everyone except yourself

Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

Verse 15 is what you fail to do

Eph 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

Verse 16 is the hinderence you cause.

Eph 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
Eph 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

In my oponion verses 17&18 are what you are guilty of.

Eph 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
Eph 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
Eph 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

All I can say of verse 29 is WOW !!!!!

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Lo the Whited Wall the Great Judge has spoken.

You are always saying that the truth must stand in the scriptures..Well so be it......Let the scriptures be yours and my judge....

Their is a double standard that I have seen for some time. When some one challenges you...they are seen as judgemental, not understanding, and in some cases just being mean to you, they don't understand you...you have been through so much. But when you spew your anger, your accusations, name calling, and judgemental attitude.. Well that just Gerald being Gerald, besides he spices up the board and brings more traffic. Sad that such a great talen that you have has come to no more than spicing up a board.

[Full Quiver]

1 Corinthians 2:1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God. 2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified. 3 And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling. 4 And my speech and my preaching [was] not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power: 5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.


If a preacher needs confirmation that what he has already preached is of God then there is an underlying problem indeed but he/she should rest assured that truth came from his/her lips when the Spirit puts His stamp of approval on the message as Paul describes in Corinthians 2.

The best thing is don't preach anything that you are not first sure of. That's safe ground!

[dolfan]

If a preacher needs confirmation that what he has already preached is of God then there is an underlying problem indeed but he/she should rest assured that truth came from his/her lips when the Spirit puts His stamp of approval on the message as Paul describes in Corinthians 2.

The best thing is don't preach anything that you are not first sure of. That's safe ground!

Now, I can agree with that although I didn't read where any of these "confirmations" were "needed". But, be sure first, speak second. That's fantastic for us all to follow, and doubly so for preachers.