As If I had enough trouble....

Gerald Creasy · Postby **Gerald Creasy** » November 5th, 2007, 1:56 pm

As If I had enough trouble, I'll ask another question.

I was at a COGOP meeting in another state.

When people were called to pray the ministers gathered around: Loud shouting, prayers and pleadings.

Suddenly one boisterous minister shouted "Holy Ghost we COMMAND you to......."

I looked at my neighbor. "Did you hear that? Did he just command the Holy Ghost?"

"That's what he said."

Do YOU command the HG?
Where in Scripture is this lined out?
Does this seem insanely disrespectful to God?
Does this show a severe problem in this ministers outlook of Pentecostalism?
Did the GO (who was present) draw him aside [I don't know but I doubt it]

You know me, it's been stuck in my craw ever since.

Mike Vande · Postby **Mike Vande** » November 5th, 2007, 2:19 pm

Gerald Creasy wrote: Do YOU command the HG?

I think the guy is lucky God is merciful. Otherwise, he could have ended up like Annaias or Sapphira.

The only other time I ever heard of anyone ordering God around, it was a WOF guy. Is that the mans's orientation?

rough_rider · Postby **rough_rider** » November 5th, 2007, 2:22 pm

Isa 45:11 Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.

Postby **Pastor Gary** » November 5th, 2007, 2:24 pm

Gerald Creasy wrote:I was at a COGOP meeting in another state.

When people were called to pray the ministers gathered around: Loud shouting, prayers and pleadings.

Suddenly one boisterous minister shouted "Holy Ghost we COMMAND you to......."

I looked at my neighbor. "Did you hear that? Did he just command the Holy Ghost?"

"That's what he said."

Do YOU command the HG?
Where in Scripture is this lined out?
Does this seem insanely disrespectful to God?
Does this show a severe problem in this ministers outlook of Pentecostalism?
Did the GO (who was present) draw him aside [I don't know but I doubt it]

You know me, it's been stuck in my craw ever since.

The Holy Ghost can not be commanded to d anything, or He is not part of the Trinity... what happened to Omnipotence??

So, Gerald, I agree with you. And I wish we could rid Christianity in general, and Pentecostalism in particular, of stupidity. But as long as there are people involved, I doubt. The man needs a good friend to pull him aside and challenge his practice... or an Overseer. :cry:

Postby **Pastor Gary** » November 5th, 2007, 2:30 pm

rough_rider wrote:Isa 45:11 Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.

Oh, the dangers of not considering context and reading multiple translations!

Try that same passage in the NIV:

"This is what the LORD says—
the Holy One of Israel, and its Maker:
Concerning things to come,
do you question me about my children,
or give me orders about the work of my hands?

...or the Contemporary English Version:

I am the LORD, the Creator,

the holy God of Israel.

Do you dare question me

about my own nation

or about what I have done?

Surely you were jesting with that verse, and don't believe it authorizes the created to command the creator!

rough_rider · Postby **rough_rider** » November 5th, 2007, 2:32 pm

Just so you know, I was not implying that the above scripture meant for us to command the Holy Ghost, just that he as some others, take that scripture to mean that.

rough_rider · Postby **rough_rider** » November 5th, 2007, 2:33 pm

PG we must have been posting at the same time...

pastorables · Postby **pastorables** » November 5th, 2007, 6:10 pm

I found this response on the subject of interest.

pa

David Reagan wrote:However, this does not mean that we are the masters and He is the servant. Just the opposite. Our commands are requests and they become commands only when God determines to do them. Again, the purpose for using the word, command, is to emphasize the way we do things through prayer. We put in our order (a word related to command) and, if approved, it is accomplished by God. Sometimes, when someone is especially close to God, these prayers can be quite bold. They can even take the form of a command, as when Jacob says to the angel of the Lord, "I will not let thee go, except thou bless me" (Genesis 32:26), or when Joshua said to the sun and moon, "Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon" (Joshua 10:12). But we should never assume that this one use of the word, command, in dealing with our relationship to God gives us the right or power to order Him around. To think so is to think foolish thoughts.

Gerald Creasy · Postby **Gerald Creasy** » November 6th, 2007, 3:05 am

pastorables wrote:I found this response on the subject of interest.

pa

David Reagan wrote:

Is this the same Dave Reagan of "Lamb & Lion" Ministries?

His tendency to interpret scripture via current events made me write him off my listening list very quickly.

JustJay · Postby **JustJay** » November 6th, 2007, 4:55 am

Not that it matters, but what were they praying about/for?

scooter · Postby **scooter** » November 6th, 2007, 8:05 am

I have heard another person do that before back in the early 1990's.

We were praying for a service just before it started and he spouted something like that. It sounded pitiful like Shirley McClane screeching like a seagull on the side of a hill "I am God".

It made me sick. :-&

pastorables · Postby **pastorables** » November 6th, 2007, 5:15 pm

Gerald Creasy wrote:

Is this the same Dave Reagan of "Lamb & Lion" Ministries?

I believe so. I don't follow him, but I found his response to this subject fair and balanced.

Jude 2