Offerings, Guest Speakers and Singing Groups

[Shellie]

TW wrote:

That would make you a mistress. Oops, I mean Mistress.

Well, see, I actually did think about that BUT...I watch Lifetime. Those chicks get shot.

[soulsearcher]

I, too, could write a chapter for this book, but may I just simply say that, for the most part, I knew what I was getting into before I got into it.

I was "reared" (Alabama, you know) in a singing/traveling family. To us, all the offering was good for was to buy a little gas and treat everyone to a hamburger. I just knew I loved to sing and play the piano and travel. I wasn't in it for the money, I was in it for the blessing, and the fun, and there was more of that to go around than I could handle.

It seems that God always wanted me out there. At least I convinced myself of that, because people kept asking me to come to their churches. If there was a way, I would get there. Those of you who know me know that I would surround myself with a troop of talented people. Bless their hearts, when I think of the great people who have traveled with me, or with whom I have had the privilege to travel (Dr. Ron , Phil Barker, Ron Scotton ) I am amazed at how God orchestrated it all, but he did.

Talent had nothing to do with it, and doesn't. It was and is willingness. At some point a person has to say, "I'm not willing to do that for that anymore," which I eventually did. But it was my decision, and I blame no one for "forcing me out." I keep seeing myself trying to explain to the Lord, "You know, God, I would have done that, but he/she/they did that... Remember?"

I wouldn't take back a minute of the experiences I had on the road sharing the gospel as God destined for me to share it, and believe me, many parts of those experiences were stupid - on my part. Somehow, God found a way to leave the good stuff, and discard the bad stuff. He's interesting like that.

I'm still doing what I love, although my traveling days are few and far between, and God is still the provider. I do what I do, and He provides... sometimes with a surprise or two up His sleeve. And the best part is that the journey isn't over yet!

Regarding the original question of this thread, I think it would be best to follow the golden rule: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you," or, "Put yourself in their place (guest speaker, singing group, etc.)... "what would you want to receive?"

[RamboPreacher]

Thanks for the replies.

I was just thinking. I know churches must get to a size where they just give someone a set amount rather than the whole offering.

why?

I know churches must get to a size where they just give someone a set amount rather than the whole offering.

I do not know why that would be considered a valid or ethical practice, especially if the singing group or speaker(and the congregation) were not aware of it in advance.

Some groups and speakers make a practice of ministering for a love offering only, rather than charging a set amount. If they are in a small church, they make a small amount, and are willing to accept that. Why should there be a limit on the size of an offereing the recieve for ministering in a large church? It's how they can provide of their families without having to set a lower limit on the size of a congregation they can minister to.

exactly my thought. I guess that I feel that if we are going to have a guest and they accept a freewill offering, they they will get the entire freewill offering.

[Dr. Ron]

Jeff, I was jerking your chain man.....what's with all seriousness these days

I know you know "Brian"...but, Yes, Imho the title does earn him a degree of respect.....and then he does have the life experience to back it up....

I don't just throw that around myself......and as for calling you or Shellie Master....no problem.....because you are ...teachers are my heros. I have had more than a few who have shaped my life for good.

Love you all....
I still think this stuff is serious.

[MrDanger]

Jeff, I was jerking your chain man.....what's with all seriousness these days

You gotta love this online stuff. I thought you were taking me seriously. I'm just having fun.

[DeWayneTN]

I was just kiddin, too.

[MrDanger]

Nah, I was just kidding about just kidding.

[RamboPreacher]

i wasn't kidding (in this thread, anyway), and at least - not yet in this thread. (JK)

[wsmitty]

I have seen it both ways. I have been able to negotiate with groups and I others only will come with certain costs. We have had everyone from David Baroni to Squire Parsons, McRaes, and more.

Someone mentioned Carman, and they are correct - his love offering as supposedly being asked by God to do is very misleading. I contacted them once to come and do a concert in our local high school. Be ready to pick up your jaw:

The cost was at the time $5000 plus breakfast and dinner and the following:

VI. Dressing Rooms

Please have 2 Dressing Rooms for Carman, Bone and his staff. Signage is not necessary—just please go over the locations with Road Manager (Cathy Highfill) upon crew arrival. Please try to have the rooms together and close to the backstage. Rooms should be clean, well lit; heated/air conditioned and be supplied with electrical power, tables, chairs and trash cans. Preferably there needs to be a bathroom in each (or at least one) or nearby the facilities.

Carman/Bone Dressing Room—this should be rather large to facilitate both
6-diet cokes (ice on side)
6-bottle waters at room temperature
Plate of strawberries
Assorted fruit
Nuts
Cheeses
Bread/Peanut Butter
4 Towels

Other Dressing Room (Band & Production)
Assorted soft drinks and water
Chips, Cheese
Fruit Trays
Nuts
Bread/Peanut Butter
10 Towels

An optional Dressing Room may be needed for Church Choir to assemble and put their personal belongings at discretion of church.

WE WILL NEED STAGE WATER FOR CARMAN, BONE (4 -8ounce bottles of room temperature water) AND MUSICIANS AND 4 BLACK WASHCLOTH-SIZED HAND TOWELS (10"x10").

I got this straight from them. They gave me a 7 page document of things that they ask for. I still have the document if anyone wants to look at it.

To me, if you are asking for certain fruits, cheeses, etc to be in your dressing room, you kind of are stuck on yourself.

[DeWayneTN]

If you really want to make your jaw drop, add another zero to that figure and that's more in the ballpark of what I heard when I first called years ago.

As far as the food, what you've mentioned is called a rider and is not unusual. In fact, this one seems less specific than some I've seen. I don't think it's an ego thing but just an industry standard that unfortunately is off-putting and surprising to some local churches when they book someone. These riders are mostly written with the independent Christian concert promoter in mind.

In my experience it is always negotiable but mainly exists to make sure a singer doesn't get treated to a local church member's homemade spaghetti every night of the week. Some will list a suggested menu for the each day and that's for the purposes of giving them some variety.

[Paully_44]

They gave me a 7 page document of things that they ask for.

Concert Riders from the Smoking Gun. It is interesting to see what bands ask for.

I don't really see anything wrong with them, some are pretty picky though. Nothing on the link regarding Christian bands or fees charged.

[Dr. Ron]

Dewayne's answer is exactly why I won't even ask the blessing over spagatti. It is horrid and inedible.

I had spagatti 9 times in 8 days in one revival and tacos 3 times. Everyone said , "but you haven't tasted MY spagatti".....and I promise you I never will tasted that nasty stuff again!!!!!! I would rather eat the bark off a tree.

When I was on the road I ate what I was offered. In one revival my team was fed balogna sandwiches every day.....with either mustard or mayo....no other condiments were offered. The pastor was being given 20.00 per day per person...$1oo.oo for all....so we ate cereal for breakfast and balogna sandwiches for lunch....no between meals were offered. (thank God for the cooler on the bus) and then spagatti or hamburgers (from his grill and no condiments) for supper. He made a lot of money off of your diet that week. My guys were hating me....for booking that meeting....but then we were not allowed to ask for a "specific amount". Just for for what they give you.....
The pastor would raise the offerings each night by saying..."with this big bus and all this equipment and the suits alike, you can see they don't need money ,,,,but if you have some spare , then lets give them a little something ".

And I could go on and on......he later became a state overseer.....too bad he didn't get his offering boosted like that in state convention.

I have been in that business a long time....so are my kids....and nothing that is mentioned above is asking too much. They are specifying so that there is not a waste in providing stuff that won't be used...basically it is saying "this is what they like"..Nothiing wrong with being specific.

Most require a buffet before the show. When Regie traveled with Larnell, they always had tables with white table cloths and all that kind of thing. It was amazing.....

[DeWayneTN]

The only extravagant thing I've ever seen in a music rider is the stipulation of limo transportation. I wrote them to say I didn't have so much trouble with the price (when you have 8-10 people, limos are as reasonable as taxis) but how it would appear to everyone so we would not be able to honor that request. After that, they declined to come.

Ron, I can imagine how sick of spaghetti you are. Bologna sammiches don't sound too appealing either.

[Pastor Gary]

I have seen it both ways. I have been able to negotiate with groups and I others only will come with certain costs. We have had everyone from David Baroni to Squire Parsons, McRaes, and more.

Someone mentioned Carman, and they are correct - his love offering as supposedly being asked by God to do is very misleading. I contacted them once to come and do a concert in our local high school. Be ready to pick up your jaw:

The cost was at the time $5000 plus breakfast and dinner and the following...
_________________________
I got this straight from them. They gave me a 7 page document of things that they ask for. I still have the document if anyone wants to look at it.

To me, if you are asking for certain fruits, cheeses, etc to be in your dressing room, you kind of are stuck on yourself.

I'll chime in here, having co-produced nearly a dozen major concerts with Michael W. Smith, Jars of Clay, Jaci Valesquez, Point of Grace, Avalon, Clay Crosse, 4 Him, Crystal Lewis, Bryan Duncan , Natalie Grant, Out of Eden, New Song, and others... big names in the CCM industry.

I dealt with not only the backstage riders but also the tech riders, and some of them are as thick as a small town phone book.

I have no problem at all with an entertainer specifying the preferred meals, snacks, etc. to avoid being served things they can't/don't eat. For example, I have a huge problem with onions. If I eat foods that are prepared with onion I get very ill. If we are invited to someone's home for dinner, and they ask "What kind of food do you folks like?" my wife always makes a point to tell them to avoid the onions, please.

Stage water? Standard rider provision for almost everyone. (Some specify the BRAND of stage water, or say "any brand except ________."

Black cloths? Same thing.

Dressing room snacks? Same -- very standard for almost al groups.

The tech riders are the tough ones: certain kinds of mics, mixers, monitors, amps, rented instruments... we have spent many thousands of dollars complying with those requirements We thought the hospitality riders were the easy, fun part!

[Pastor Gary]

The only extravagant thing I've ever seen in a music rider is the stipulation of limo transportation. I wrote them to say I didn't have so much trouble with the price (when you have 8-10 people, limos are as reasonable as taxis) but how it would appear to everyone so we would not be able to honor that request. After that, they declined to come.

Ron, I can imagine how sick of spaghetti you are. Bologna sammiches don't sound too appealing either.

I have gone to the airport and picked up the biggest names in the business in an old 17 passenger church van!