Financial Peace University

[stevenson]

He may say that on his website but in Georgia they were taking credit cards. And it wasn't being ran as a debit! Somebody I was with, used their business credit card, and had to sign! I was standing right next to him when he did it.And that was at a Dave Ramsey Booth. Then I walked down to a Andy Stanley Booth and bought a video with my credit card! So credit cards were everywhere and being accepted at every booth!

Alot of what he teaches is just common sense. We just live in a day and time when people don't have common sense. I put a $1,000 dollars in my checking account many years ago after a very old man advised me to do so. Then I balance my checkbook out to say $0. Now when I'm at $0, I really have $1,000. Everybody should pay 10% tithes and then put 5-10% into an interest bearing savings account. If your job offers a 401K, put in the maxium amount that they'll match you to.

I don't agree with what he teaches about real estate. I understand what he's saying. But it's not always wise to go with a 15 year loan instead of a 30. Depends on your tax bracket and how long you plan on keeping the house.

Like I said it's all common sense stuff that Dave Ramsey will sell you for $299 plus $93 for each person that takes the class. LOL! You can take Larry Burkett's course at Crown Financial for about 10% of the cost of Ramsey's.

[Full Quiver]

You know I love you John but I must ask, do you have debt, do you rely on credit cards, are you a multimillionaire, and do you have a nationally syndicated radio show that started out in nashville, TN on a talk station that almost went bust?

[DaJudge]

I don't agree with what he teaches about real estate. I understand what he's saying. But it's not always wise to go with a 15 year loan instead of a 30. Depends on your tax bracket and how long you plan on keeping the house.

I like what Dave Ramsey says about this: "nobody in the history of the world ever got foreclosed on who had a paid off house"

It never makes sense to maintain mortgage debt if you don't have to. The tax benefit never equals amount you pay in interest.

[Full Quiver]

Amen and if you're looking for a tax break then with a paid off mortgage you should have plenty of money to GIVE to tax deductible charities.

[darylscook]

Dave Ramsey teaches that the best way to use your debit card is to use it like a credit card, which means you have to sign for it. By using your Visa trademarked debit card using the credit funtionality, you have the 0 liability, but it still comes out of your checking account.

He takes Visa/Mastercard so that you can use your debit card as a Visa/MC card; There is no function for the system to tell the difference, He asks that you do only use a credit card that is based on your checking account and serves as a Visa/MC debit. When I use my Debit card as a credit card, I have to sign for it, but it still comes out of my checking account.

If someone is going to be dishonest and use their credit card anyway, well, I guess the system won't work anyway. I have ordered from His site and it NEVER occured to me that I could try and use a credit card instead of a debit b/c I was told this is only for Debit Card Visa/Mastercards.

God Bless You
Daryl

[stevenson]

You know I love you John but I must ask, do you have debt,

real estate only! We paid off all our debts years ago. We were over a quater of a million dollars in debt. Soon after we first got married our son was born very sick and spent almost a year in the hospital. Then a couple of years later my wife needed heart surgery. We were in debt bad. We were getting food stamps. I remember the welfare office making us feel like garbage. When we got down to our last food stamp I told my wife we weren't going back to welfare that we would rely on God for all our needs! We still have that last $1 food stamp to remember that day by!

do you rely on credit cards,

NO! I have one for emergencies and I always pay it off as soon as the bill comes in.

are you a multimillionaire,

No! But what does that have to do with anything? If I gave advice like Ramsey and charge what he did, I'd be a multimillionaire but I'd also not be doing what God told me to do!

and do you have a nationally syndicated radio show that started out in nashville, TN on a talk station that almost went bust?

I worked in radio when Ramsey was going bust! I left radio for the ministry. I graduated from the Ohio School of Broadcasting. And again what does that have to do with anything? I have worked for companies that almost went bust until I was brought in and I still own stock in one of them.

I'm not saying Ramsey is wrong. But as a full time minister, who has to pay ALL of his own taxes, I'll keep my mortgage payment. If you work a secular job and they take taxes out of you a 15 year loan is fine. And that's mostly who Ramsey is talking to.

Here's a great article you might enjoy http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/columnist/waggon/2005-04-21-mortgage_x.htm

[stevenson]

Just a p.s., if you use this

are you a multimillionaire, and do you have a nationally syndicated radio show that started out in nashville, TN on a talk station that almost went bust?

to qualify Dave Ramsey, then you should take advice from the Muslims and oil companies cuz your using wealth to qualify. Jesus never did any of those things either, would you choose Dave's advice over Jesus"?

Don't ever qualify someone by their pocket book! Dave Ramsey got rich by charging you and ME for things that are readily available and free! He didn't get rich by investments and real estate. He got rich off of us!

[stevenson]

Another p.s., I just got off the phone with a friend of mine that says Ramsey had nothing to do with WWTN not going bankrupt. He says that even after Ramsey was brought in the ship was sinking until Gaylord Entertainment bought the station and paid off all the debts. He says that actually Ramsey's career was actually boosted thanks to Gaylord buying the station and keeping him on staff. The Gaylord tuned the station into a money maker then sold it to Cumulus Media.

So again, what did your question have to do with anything? Never assume and always check your sources!

I feel like a school teacher today, Good Grief Charlie Brown! LOL!

[dolfan]

'Dave Ramsey got rich off of common sense.' I've heard that said, and it is true. Which means what? We could all use a lot more common sense, right?! I like listening to him, he knows whereof he speaks in terms of debt elimination, which is his goal. He is not a tax adviser, so when you talk to him about using mortgage interest as a deduction, he just doesn't care. He wants you to leave debt, not to leverage it. If you want to balance Dave's message, then listen to Clark Howard, too. Both are consumer-friendly advisors, but Clark Howard doesn't plead and educate on how to be 100% debt-free.

I'll say this: Only a person who has no debts is truly free. You can have debt and still be crazy rich or dirt poor, but if someone else owns your bank account or house, etc., he's the master. What's the goal: freedom or wealth? If you have to choose between them, Dave's right. If you may choose between them, Dave's probably right. If you can't choose between them, Dave is irrelevant to your situation --- which makes you the perfect person to listen to him.

[Dr. Ron]

Well said dolfan.

We all need to practice the best ways in which to be debt free.

I always look at my equity in my home before assessing debt. If there is none....which happened a few years ago, then I am in big trouble.

As for the tax advantages of homeownership, they are not nearly as favorable as owning the home outright.

Anyway.. I couldn't have said it better man!

[DaJudge]

Just a p.s., if you use this

are you a multimillionaire, and do you have a nationally syndicated radio show that started out in nashville, TN on a talk station that almost went bust?

to qualify Dave Ramsey, then you should take advice from the Muslims and oil companies cuz your using wealth to qualify. Jesus never did any of those things either, would you choose Dave's advice over Jesus"?

Don't ever qualify someone by their pocket book! Dave Ramsey got rich by charging you and ME for things that are readily available and free! He didn't get rich by investments and real estate. He got rich off of us!

Why all the hatin' on Dave Ramsey, Stevenson? Did he kick sand in your face in the schoolyard when you were kids?

[stevenson]

I ain't! I just disagree with one little itsy bitsy part of what he says and FQ starts on that because I don't have millions of dollars I don't know what I'm talking about. I think FQ's the one hatin", not me. Go back and reread it.

And if ya all listen to Ramsey you would notice that at the end of his show he gives a disclaimer. That disclaimer says that he's giving a broad statements and that each of us should seek the help of a professional financial advisor for our particular situation.I've stood 10 feet from Dave. He gives you the basics but you have to tailor it to your situation.

So I ain't a hatin", but somebody else is just because I disagree a little. That's okay, I still love em'!

dolfan wrote:

I'll say this: Only a person who has no debts is truly free. You can have debt and still be crazy rich or dirt poor, but if someone else owns your bank account or house, etc., he's the master.

This made me think.....how many of our churches owe the bank???? Hmmm! So takin what dolfan said at face value if your church owes a bank then Jesus isn't the Master but the bank?

[RamboPreacher]

stevenson - you're not alone.

the benefit of the tax deduction of interest is by no means an excuse to keep on having a mortgage. but it can help depending on your personality and POV regarding money, how you save or don't and how this can change your tax bracket or not. there are many variables and by just saying that it's always best to own, isn't necessarily the best option, depending on the process one is taking to get out of debt. (BTW - don't know who Dave Ramsey is. does he play basket ball or something? )

and am I the only one that sees FPU as Financial-PU (stinky)?

When I held a series of classes on Biblical and Godly stewardship (including several sessions on financial stewardship) at church, financial planning is all well and good, but if nobody wants to acknowledge the "B"-word, then there isn't much further than one can go. We went over a very generic budget on paper and presentation and all but one or maybe two had their eyes gloss over and you could tell they didn't care, because they weren't going to do anything with a budget.

I had someone even tell me that they can't afford to budget. why? because when they write out all their bills and incomes, there isn't enough money coming in to pay the bills, on paper. interesting logic.

[stevenson]

Rambo, your right, it all comes down to the "B" word. And to many people live above their means. I think credit can be a good thing if used wisely. I hope he doesn't mind me using his name but Roughrider and myself along with another person signed a loan to help a small struggling church get a facelift. And I was happy that we could help, Ramsey would have objected to that. But we all felt that it was for a good cause.

You also got to remember that if everyone followed Ramsey's advice, it would do more harm than good. Millions of people in the housing and banking market would loose their jobs. The auto industry would slow way down and have to lay off people. And all this would have a trickle down effect. I believe Ramsey makes a lot of good points. That's why I don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

The only thing I said from the get go is that I don't buy into to what he's saying about mortgages. And I also think he charges alot of money for "free" information. Larry Burkett taught the same stuff for years at a much lower cost.

BTW, my wife and I used Larry's system to get out of debt!

[Full Quiver]

Look John, I aint hatin on you bro. I guess I'll bow out of this discussion and ask your forgiveness if you feel that I have attacked you.