http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/01/us/01 ... tml?ref=us
Native Group Occupies Grounds of Palace
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: May 1, 2008
HONOLULU (AP) — A group of Native Hawaiians on Wednesday locked the gates of Iolani Palace, the former home of Hawaiian royalty, and took over the grounds.
The group, Hawaiian Kingdom Government, said it would occupy the palace grounds indefinitely and start carrying out the business of what it considers the legitimate government of the Hawaiian Islands.
.....
The group’s leader, Mahealani Kahau, said the group did not recognize Hawaii as an American state.
The group is one of several Hawaiian sovereignty organizations in the islands, which became the 50th state in 1959.
Hawaii seceding from US???
Moderators: Pastor Gary, The J2 Mod Squad
Hawaii seceding from US???
"A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still." Anonymous
"Arguing with some people is like wrestling with a pig, at the end you are both filthy and exhausted –and you get the distinct feeling that the pig enjoyed the experience."
"Arguing with some people is like wrestling with a pig, at the end you are both filthy and exhausted –and you get the distinct feeling that the pig enjoyed the experience."
Hawaii sceding from the US
If they will pay us back all we have invested....with interest.....let em go.
Hope they can raise an army that can defend them and stuff.
Hope they can raise an army that can defend them and stuff.
Dr. Ron
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Pastor Gary
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Yuk it up
Careful about commenting upon what you do not understand.
This is a serious political and sociological issue in Hawaii, and, yes, there are MANY Native Hawaiians call for a restoration of sovereignty. Many of them are Christians. Some of them COG/COGOP members.
The Hawaiian Kingdom was modern, progressive and well-established when the U.S. Marines landed in Honolulu, imprisoned Queen Liliuokalani in her own Palace, and overthrew the lawful government of the Kingdom of Hawaii. The Queen, a devout Christian, the organist at Kawaiahao Church, chose to call fore her people to lay down their arms and surrender to the Marines to spare them death and bloodshed. It was an injustice. Sadly, some of the conspirators who arranged the Marine invasion were the sons of Missionaries who came to Hawaii to do GOOD and did WELL, instead.
As for "pay(ing) the cost of divesting for US government property and US citizens property" -- if you make a spreadsheet of what was stolen from them and what they "owe" the invaders for the privilege of being invaded, the Hawaiians still win.
There are legitimate grievances that will eventually be redressed in some way -- a "State within a State" or some other model. Hawaiians can't seem to agree among themselves on the ideal solution, and, until they are in complete political unity it will remain a festering boil.
As for U.S. Citizenship: many -- MANY -- Native Hawaiians have in fact already renounced their American Citizenship and declared themselves citizens of the "Kingdom of Hawaii." The sovereignty movement is not just a bunch of wild-eyed radicals; many Christian leaders and pastors are among their ranks, and at least ONE of the groups seeks to restore Hawaii as a Parliamentary Republic with a (largely ceremonial) monarch... the descendants of the illegally deposed Queen are alive and respected -- and they promote a Christian Kingdom under the Lordship of Jesus Christ.
This is a serious political and sociological issue in Hawaii, and, yes, there are MANY Native Hawaiians call for a restoration of sovereignty. Many of them are Christians. Some of them COG/COGOP members.
The Hawaiian Kingdom was modern, progressive and well-established when the U.S. Marines landed in Honolulu, imprisoned Queen Liliuokalani in her own Palace, and overthrew the lawful government of the Kingdom of Hawaii. The Queen, a devout Christian, the organist at Kawaiahao Church, chose to call fore her people to lay down their arms and surrender to the Marines to spare them death and bloodshed. It was an injustice. Sadly, some of the conspirators who arranged the Marine invasion were the sons of Missionaries who came to Hawaii to do GOOD and did WELL, instead.
As for "pay(ing) the cost of divesting for US government property and US citizens property" -- if you make a spreadsheet of what was stolen from them and what they "owe" the invaders for the privilege of being invaded, the Hawaiians still win.
There are legitimate grievances that will eventually be redressed in some way -- a "State within a State" or some other model. Hawaiians can't seem to agree among themselves on the ideal solution, and, until they are in complete political unity it will remain a festering boil.
As for U.S. Citizenship: many -- MANY -- Native Hawaiians have in fact already renounced their American Citizenship and declared themselves citizens of the "Kingdom of Hawaii." The sovereignty movement is not just a bunch of wild-eyed radicals; many Christian leaders and pastors are among their ranks, and at least ONE of the groups seeks to restore Hawaii as a Parliamentary Republic with a (largely ceremonial) monarch... the descendants of the illegally deposed Queen are alive and respected -- and they promote a Christian Kingdom under the Lordship of Jesus Christ.
"God is excited to show you mercy. He rises to give you His compassion." (Isaiah 30:18)
"For surely, O LORD, you bless the righteous; you surround them with your favor as with a shield." (Psalm 5:12)
"For surely, O LORD, you bless the righteous; you surround them with your favor as with a shield." (Psalm 5:12)
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Mike Vande
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Gary, wasn't Queen Lileuokalani allowed to remain deposed because of her intention to behead the conspirators, the traditional punishment for crimes against the royalty, rather than issue an amnesty as the US Government requested? If I recall from Michener's book, some of the conspirators claimed US citizenship, and the US gov. didn't want to be embarrassed by a foreign power executing it's citizens...
Why is it that bad decisions seem to make to most interesting testimonies?
Gary, do the secessionists recognize the benefits that have inured to Hawaii by living under the protection of the USA first as a territory and then as a state?
If we had left them alone and unprotected, they wouldn't be ruled by a benevolent Christian monarch, they would be ruled by the Emperor of Japan.
If we had left them alone and unprotected, they wouldn't be ruled by a benevolent Christian monarch, they would be ruled by the Emperor of Japan.
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Pastor Gary
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Michener
Mike Vande wrote:Gary, wasn't Queen Lileuokalani allowed to remain deposed because of her intention to behead the conspirators, the traditional punishment for crimes against the royalty, rather than issue an amnesty as the US Government requested? If I recall from Michener's book, some of the conspirators claimed US citizenship, and the US gov. didn't want to be embarrassed by a foreign power executing it's citizens...
I think Michener is a great fiction writer, but as a historian? I have never heard a credible Hawaiian historian relate anything about potential beheading.
"God is excited to show you mercy. He rises to give you His compassion." (Isaiah 30:18)
"For surely, O LORD, you bless the righteous; you surround them with your favor as with a shield." (Psalm 5:12)
"For surely, O LORD, you bless the righteous; you surround them with your favor as with a shield." (Psalm 5:12)
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Pastor Gary
- Kahu Gary, Benevolent Dictator
- Posts: 10475
- Joined: January 28th, 2003, 9:03 pm
- Location: USA,Hawaii
- Contact:
Benefits (?)
DaJudge wrote:Gary, do the secessionists recognize the benefits that have inured to Hawaii by living under the protection of the USA first as a territory and then as a state?
If we had left them alone and unprotected, they wouldn't be ruled by a benevolent Christian monarch, they would be ruled by the Emperor of Japan.
They contend, perhaps correctly, that Japan only attacked Hawaii because of the presence of the fleet at Pearl Harbor, and never landed ground troops... and because of distance, Japan would have had little reason to attempt to expand into these islands. (Supply lines, etc.)
They also contend that American culture and life has been disastrous for Hawaiians; decades of American fast food has rendered them overweight and unhealthy, their youth has adopted the basest of hip hop culture at the expense of their own culture, the U.S. Government controls major chunks of land on Oahu -- some of the best prime real estate on the island...
...making property values here even more artificially inflated than necessary.
"God is excited to show you mercy. He rises to give you His compassion." (Isaiah 30:18)
"For surely, O LORD, you bless the righteous; you surround them with your favor as with a shield." (Psalm 5:12)
"For surely, O LORD, you bless the righteous; you surround them with your favor as with a shield." (Psalm 5:12)
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