Is Christ a stranger in a Spirit-filled congregation?

[rough_rider]

Repentance, holiness, visible signs, and manifestations are part of a mighty move of God. I'm not sticking up for T.B. or the happenings in Lakeland, but there has been folks from the CoGoP, CoG that I know that has been there and they are not sign followers. If I'm not mistaken, there are some on J2 that has went to the revival, I would not lable them as sign followers.
I don't want to get caught up in the debate of the Lakeland being a legit outpouring of God or not. What I watched on tv, I've enjoyed, but then again I was not sitting and waiting to catch him in something wrong. Yes, the angel thing is disturbing to a point. And I don't think a christian can be head spinning possessed by the devil, but there are christians out there that are in need of deliverance. When I got saved, God delivered me right then and there from drugs and alcohol. I went home that night and dumped it all down the toilet. Yet there are men and women of God today that are in bondage to drugs, alcohol, porno ect and are in need of deliverance.

[rough_rider]

Double post, sorry...

[dbserv]

Repentance, holiness, visible signs, and manifestations are part of a mighty move of God. I'm not sticking up for T.B. or the happenings in Lakeland, but there has been folks from the CoGoP, CoG that I know that has been there and they are not sign followers. If I'm not mistaken, there are some on J2 that has went to the revival, I would not lable them as sign followers.

Maybe you wouldn't, but ..............................................

[THE RAzEr]

Dupicated. Sorry!

[THE RAzEr]

I don't think it's so much 'believers following signs", but rather believers longing to be in the midst and part of a mighty outpouring of the Holy Ghost. There are some I'm sure that have traveled to Lakeland chasing signs, then there is those who have an earnest hunger for a mighty move of God.

The difference you describe is too subtle for me; most of those who have traveled to Lakeland DEFINE "a mighty move of God" and "and outpouring of the Holy Ghost" not by repentance and holiness, but by visible signs and manifestations.

The Apostle Paul does so in I COR 12. He says very little about holiness or even salvation in this chapter. When these things are real they are a significant sign of Spiritual Maifestation.

Crocadile tears. She washed his feet with her tears and dried them with her hair.

Waves of Emotion. He fell at his feet and cried my Lord and my God.

I am reminded of the peiople who came to Lazarus' house, not to see Jesus, but to see the one whom Jesus had raised from the dead. Were these believers following signs. If they were it turned out well. For many who came to see Lazerus believed on the One who raised him. This is the story of belivers who came to see the miracle, and stayed to belive in the Source of the Miracle.

What die the people come to see in Jesus' day. If we find the answer we may find out what they will come to see today. When they come, they will believe in Christ if he is lifted up for he will draw all men unto him.

Bentley may be as crooked as can be, I do not know. However, I do know God can save in a den of devils.

What I see is a tendency among some to discount any claim of a move of God anywhere. It is just not Bentley, but it is skepticism of any claim. It is the demandinding of some sort of proof.

John the Baptist wanted to know if Jesus was for real. Jesus did not send doctrinal thesis, sermons or even Scripture to let John know who He was.
Jesus answer to the disciples of John was not a Doctor's report or a line of eye witnesses. He just simply stated it was happening. I am very fearful that if Jesus sent us the same report today we would ask for verification.

Ray

[pastorables]

What I see is a tendency among some to discount any claim of a move of God anywhere. It is just not Bentley, but it is skepticism of any claim. It is the demandinding of some sort of proof.

John the Baptist wanted to know if Jesus was for real. Jesus did not send doctrinal thesis, sermons or even Scripture to let John know who He was.
Jesus answer to the disciples of John was not a Doctor's report or a line of eye witnesses. He just simply stated it was happening. I am very fearful that if Jesus sent us the same report today we would ask for verification.

Ray

And this is my heart also...

[one love]

I don't think it's so much 'believers following signs", but rather believers longing to be in the midst and part of a mighty outpouring of the Holy Ghost. There are some I'm sure that have traveled to Lakeland chasing signs, then there is those who have an earnest hunger for a mighty move of God.

The difference you describe is too subtle for me; most of those who have traveled to Lakeland DEFINE "a mighty move of God" and "and outpouring of the Holy Ghost" not by repentance and holiness, but by visible signs and manifestations.

The Apostle Paul does so in I COR 12. He says very little about holiness or even salvation in this chapter. When these things are real they are a significant sign of Spiritual Maifestation.

Crocadile tears. She washed his feet with her tears and dried them with her hair.

Waves of Emotion. He fell at his feet and cried my Lord and my God.

I am reminded of the peiople who came to Lazarus' house, not to see Jesus, but to see the one whom Jesus had raised from the dead. Were these believers following signs. If they were it turned out well. For many who came to see Lazerus believed on the One who raised him. This is the story of belivers who came to see the miracle, and stayed to belive in the Source of the Miracle.

What die the people come to see in Jesus' day. If we find the answer we may find out what they will come to see today. When they come, they will believe in Christ if he is lifted up for he will draw all men unto him.

Bentley may be as crooked as can be, I do not know. However, I do know God can save in a den of devils.

What I see is a tendency among some to discount any claim of a move of God anywhere. It is just not Bentley, but it is skepticism of any claim. It is the demandinding of some sort of proof.

John the Baptist wanted to know if Jesus was for real. Jesus did not send doctrinal thesis, sermons or even Scripture to let John know who He was.
Jesus answer to the disciples of John was not a Doctor's report or a line of eye witnesses. He just simply stated it was happening. I am very fearful that if Jesus sent us the same report today we would ask for verification.

Ray

I agree with this , good post.

[dolfan]

I'll believe a move of God is on when people sell their stuff and give to the poor, when people open their homes to each other, when strangers are received with gladness, when fathers work to feed their children and stop feeding their egos and libidos, when people cry with broken hearts at the wreck this world is and decide to follow Him to the ends of it to make it closer to His ways and they start that by loving their enemies. When those kinds of things are visibly manifested, then I'll think there's a move of God; otherwise, no type or number of so-called miracles is going to convince me that God is "up to something new" or that a real revival is on. And, anytime I see someone pointing heavenward as the source of a circus act and calling it revival, I'm going to dismiss that person as a clown.

[jessea]

Dolfan said:

I'll believe a move of God is on when people sell their stuff and give to the poor, when people open their homes to each other, when strangers are received with gladness, when fathers work to feed their children and stop feeding their egos and libidos, when people cry with broken hearts at the wreck this world is and decide to follow Him to the ends of it to make it closer to His ways and they start that by loving their enemies. When those kinds of things are visibly manifested, then I'll think there's a move of God; otherwise, no type or number of so-called miracles is going to convince me that God is "up to something new" or that a real revival is on. And, anytime I see someone pointing heavenward as the source of a circus act and calling it revival, I'm going to dismiss that person as a clown.

Amen! That is the gospel of Christ! That is the power of gospel.

[Gerald Creasy]

I'll believe a move of God is on when people sell their stuff and give to the poor, when people open their homes to each other, when strangers are received with gladness, when fathers work to feed their children and stop feeding their egos and libidos, when people cry with broken hearts at the wreck this world is and decide to follow Him to the ends of it to make it closer to His ways and they start that by loving their enemies. When those kinds of things are visibly manifested, then I'll think there's a move of God; otherwise, no type or number of so-called miracles is going to convince me that God is "up to something new" or that a real revival is on. And, anytime I see someone pointing heavenward as the source of a circus act and calling it revival, I'm going to dismiss that person as a clown.

I think I've found a new tag line.

[Full Quiver]

Amen Dolfan!

Ray, maybe the folks coming to see Lazarus were his old friends and wanted to be reunited again. Sure some folks probably had to see for themselves but when they got there Jesus, his disciples, not Lazarus were carrying on with a side show.

Bentley may be as crooked as can be, I do not know. However, I do know God can save in a den of devils.

What I see is a tendency among some to discount any claim of a move of God anywhere. It is just not Bentley, but it is skepticism of any claim. It is the demandinding of some sort of proof.

YES, God can save in a den of devils BUT we as Christians and servants of the most high God should NEVER point people towards any den of devils. Why on Earth would you or I want our names attached to such nonsense? Our very own integrity is at stake when we sanction such and the kingdom as a whole is looked down upon by a MUCH larger crowd then Todd Bentley has ever or will ever draw because of the things that Bentley does in the name of OUR Lord the whole while we, the kingdom, seem to be approving of him. The kingdom needs to obey the Scripture and start living above reproach instead of making excuses.

BTW, Many sign followers walked away from the Lord when He started teaching "hard" things.

[THE RAzEr]

Amen Dolfan!

Ray, maybe the folks coming to see Lazarus were his old friends and wanted to be reunited again. Sure some folks probably had to see for themselves but when they got there Jesus, his disciples, not Lazarus were carrying on with a side show.

Bentley may be as crooked as can be, I do not know. However, I do know God can save in a den of devils.

What I see is a tendency among some to discount any claim of a move of God anywhere. It is just not Bentley, but it is skepticism of any claim. It is the demandinding of some sort of proof.

YES, God can save in a den of devils BUT we as Christians and servants of the most high God should NEVER point people towards any den of devils. Why on Earth would you or I want our names attached to such nonsense? Our very own integrity is at stake when we sanction such and the kingdom as a whole is looked down upon by a MUCH larger crowd then Todd Bentley has ever or will ever draw because of the things that Bentley does in the name of OUR Lord the whole while we, the kingdom, seem to be approving of him. The kingdom needs to obey the Scripture and start living above reproach instead of making excuses.

BTW, Many sign followers walked away from the Lord when He started teaching "hard" things.

I ask you read the chapter. Jesus was not going to minister in that area. They were seeking to kill him. He did however go by to see Lazareth. I do not know who the people were that came to see Lazareth, but the Scripture says they came "not to see Jesus". The scripture says they came to see the one who had been raised from the dead. Even jesus himself kmew many of the people came for the miracles, the fishes and the loaves. There were places where multitudes (multiple thousands) came and "he healed them all".

Many people have come for the show and found the Lord. Many of our churches began with the work of men who were great showman. People came to see the evangelist. They came to here the singing. My father came to ask the Preacher girl to the dance. He got saved. His father was a moonshiner, and my father at age 17 strated preaching. he had 50 years of ministry and more. Before he died he was calling everybody he could across this country telling them the doctor said he was going home. He would have us prop him up on the church wall so he could beat his tamborine. It wasn't his knowledge of the scriptures that got him to the church. It was MS Curry in a wagon with a bunch of people beating on wash boards heading down a country road to town. They were going to clean up the old chicken house, and have a revival. My dad didn't know what a revival was. My Dad would have died in his sins waiting for most churches to come by the BootLeggers house.

Most of our churches even in large cities are pretty empty. We are preaching our up right doctine to the pews. We preach healing to a sick world who isn't interested because they haven't seen it put in practice in our cchurches. They don't come to our churches. We don't take it to them. When we have something real to offer, then we may be able to convince the world of what is false. Until then we are blow smoke ourselves.

And you are right, some started moving a way from the Lord when he stated teaching hard things. But the Body of Christ (JESUS) gave the Body of Christ (the Church) a great example to follow. Get the people first. he did the signs and the wonders. He got the crowd! he then taught them the hard things. Some did stay. The same was true in the Book of ACT. The day of pentecost, Solomon's porch, Peter's shadow in the street. let god mainifest--get a crowd--preach a sermon- people are saved--Baptize them- equip them.

We are not all a bunch of decievers. There are some. paul wrote about them. He tlk in tongues more than all. He cast out devils. He pryed im the spirit, and with understamding. he took his lickings, and fought the fight, and kept the Faith dispite the decievers wolves and charlitans. And was not ashamed to write them and say, "Paul, and Apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ."

I am not ashamed either. I am a blood bought hild of God, saved by Grace, Baptized with the Holy ghost. I f God so wills and he does, I can Preach the Gospel , cast out Devils, lay hands on the sick and see them recover, I talk in tongues, tache sunday school sometimes, visit the sick , feed my family, work a job, travel in meetings on weekends, read my Bible, pray, fast, feast. lay hands on people to recieve the Holy Ghost, write gospel songs, books and poems about Jesus, comment more than I should on Jude2, go to some time 4 services on Sunday, try to live righteously, and I have been know to sell fried chicken for the building fund,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, If in the process the Spirit comes over me, and i want to take time to jump a pew, run the aisle, and dance in the spirit, if some body don't like it----------------I'll do it around somebody who does. It is not in how high you jump, its how straight you walk when your feet touch the ground. Wellllllllllllllllllllll Glory!!

Ray

[Pastor Gary]

I am not ashamed either. I am a blood bought hild of God, saved by Grace, Baptized with the Holy ghost. I f God so wills and he does, I can Preach the Gospel , cast out Devils, lay hands on the sick and see them recover, I talk in tongues, tache sunday school sometimes, visit the sick , feed my family, work a job, travel in meetings on weekends, read my Bible, pray, fast, feast. lay hands on people to recieve the Holy Ghost, write gospel songs, books and poems about Jesus, comment more than I should on Jude2, go to some time 4 services on Sunday, try to live righteously, and I have been know to sell fried chicken for the building fund,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, If in the process the Spirit comes over me, and i want to take time to jump a pew, run the aisle, and dance in the spirit, if some body don't like it----------------I'll do it around somebody who does. It is not in how high you jump, its how straight you walk when your feet touch the ground. Wellllllllllllllllllllll Glory!!

GREAT!!! What a wonderful testimony. Since you are A1, 100% the real del, I know you'll want to join the rest of us real-deals in exposing the works of darkness, the deceivers and false prophets who might keep the sincere but gullible from experiencing the glorious grace and anointing we enjoy.

(Nobody here is arguing against the genuine -- just the phoney-baloney that am sure makes you as sick as it makes me.)

[THE RAzEr]

I am not ashamed either. I am a blood bought hild of God, saved by Grace, Baptized with the Holy ghost. I f God so wills and he does, I can Preach the Gospel , cast out Devils, lay hands on the sick and see them recover, I talk in tongues, tache sunday school sometimes, visit the sick , feed my family, work a job, travel in meetings on weekends, read my Bible, pray, fast, feast. lay hands on people to recieve the Holy Ghost, write gospel songs, books and poems about Jesus, comment more than I should on Jude2, go to some time 4 services on Sunday, try to live righteously, and I have been know to sell fried chicken for the building fund,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, If in the process the Spirit comes over me, and i want to take time to jump a pew, run the aisle, and dance in the spirit, if some body don't like it----------------I'll do it around somebody who does. It is not in how high you jump, its how straight you walk when your feet touch the ground. Wellllllllllllllllllllll Glory!!

GREAT!!! What a wonderful testimony. Since you are A1, 100% the real del, I know you'll want to join the rest of us real-deals in exposing the works of darkness, the deceivers and false prophets who might keep the sincere but gullible from experiencing the glorious grace and anointing we enjoy.

(Nobody here is arguing against the genuine -- just the phoney-baloney that am sure makes you as sick as it makes me.)

I have no problem joining in expostion of of evil. if I have had argument with you about you exposing it I don't recall such. If I have refused to joined in the exposing of evil, I do not know when it was. i do know a few times when it has been inferred that i do not join in it.

Now it has been more than inferred to other people. It has been said straigth up. Thank you Sir for joining me in denoucing that.

Are you a Pentecostal? If you are, you may need to check the experation date on your baloney wrapper. It has been exposed on the forum that pentecostal accept all the evil junk you want to expose. as the line at the bottom of my post reads, I am "Pentecostal to the bone". Do you remember when I put this on my posts. Maybe not. I do, and I remember why.

If you or anyone else on this board is Pentecostal, Gerald Creasey is calling you out. He has done so continually. Bentley, Hinn, Kenyon etc may be what he uses to do it, but he puts us all in their boat. I am not in their boat. Also, I am not going to take the paddle and row Gerald's canoe. The baloneyin his canoe, seems a little spoiled to me.

Nobody is argueing for the phoney-baloney either. There are differant ways to fix real baloney. I like mine fried with grits and eggs.

I am allergic to beef, so I have to eat turkey or chicken Balony, if I eat it at all. Beef eaters might call this phoney baloney. I think it depends a lot on whether the balony denominations maufactors have an affinity more to cows or turkeys.

Any body that knows me, puts me with the turkeys!!
Ray

[dolfan]

The baloneyin his canoe, seems a little spoiled to me.

Nobody is argueing for the phoney-baloney either. There are differant ways to fix real baloney. I like mine fried with grits and eggs.

I am allergic to beef, so I have to eat turkey or chicken Balony, if I eat it at all. Beef eaters might call this phoney baloney. I think it depends a lot on whether the balony denominations maufactors have an affinity more to cows or turkeys.

Any body that knows me, puts me with the turkeys!!
Ray

Razer, I like you just dandy and I hope I can say this in a way that shows it. ............................................. What in the world are you talking about?!?