poverty in the US (just a thought)

[TW]

We in America have some of the richest poor in the world. There are none that go naked. Hunger and homelessness is usually a matter of chemical dependancy and/or mental illness...not anything else. I have worked with and ministered to the homeless here in America and know only full well that for most of them it is simply a choice. They are homeless for a variety of reasons...but mostly it boils down to choice...theirs as to why they are where they are...not any other reason. Granted they can usually tell some colorful and heart wrenching stories here in America...but the truth is something different than the stories they tell.

John, I pray the Lord is more understanding with you than you are with the people of Appalachia. I read in your Roll Call post that you have ministered to the homeless, and all the various places that you have lived. My guess is that this ministry took place within an urban environment. You might very well be correct as to your assesment of the root cause of thiose homeless that you have come in contact with. However, I would ask you to get out of your comfort zone, get off the Interstate and get into the deep back woods in the hills and mountains of Appalachia. It's a whole different world outside the city John. Come face to face with what happens when the only industry in an area shuts down. Here is a map showing the poverty rates through out Appalachia:



I don't think that all these people have a dependency problem. Mountain people the world over, with the exception of the Alpine countries, are amoung the poorest of all the worlds people. The people of Appalachia are no different. Here are two pictures:



One is in Napal the other is in Appalachia, I don't see very much difference. Do You?


TW

[Pastor Gary]

One is in Napal the other is in Appalachia, I don't see very much difference. Do You?

TW - the poor family is Nepal can go nowhere else for a fresh start. The poor family in Appalachia can -- they probably would rather NOT, and perhaps WOULD not, but they CAN.

[Gerald Creasy]

TW - the poor family is Nepal can go nowhere else for a fresh start. The poor family in Appalachia can -- they probably would rather NOT, and perhaps WOULD not, but they CAN.

those in poverty in appalachia still have options unavailable to the 3rd world poor. Mobility, for one. They can leave appalachia, even if on foot,

Somehow I fail to see the compassion within the belief that because a woman can hike a hundred or so miles of mountainous terrain with a child on her hip and one or two in tow in order to live for a while under a city overpass until she finds help that she is somehow more advantaged.

[Pastor Gary]

Somehow I fail to see the compassion within the belief that because a woman can hike a hundred or so miles of mountainous terrain with a child on her hip and one or two in tow in order to live for a while under a city overpass until she finds help that she is somehow more advantaged.

Then I invite you to go see what poverty looks like where a mother with 5 or 6 starving, sick children will hike for hundreds of miles across barren wasteland to get to a refugee camp where her kids can get a handful of rice every day and a possibility of survival.

I know there's poverty in America. There is far worse poverty almost everywhere else in the world.

[JohnDB]

Here in America there is a social welfare safety net. A person starving can get emergency food stamps...especially for their children. The Salvation Army can and will clothe anyone in dire need of clothing.

I personally know several social workers. They remove children from homes where the parent(s) refuse to go and get food and clothes from this safety net. The money may be issued on a state level but it is under federal dollars and guidelines as to what and when things must happen when a social worker comes upon dire poverty.

I know of no such programs in these other countries.

We also have churchs that do take care of homeless in America through their domestic missions programs like Annie Armstrong (Baptist organization). They also usually have many other programs as well.

Food in America is relatively inexpensive. It doesn't require half of a person's normal income to feed a family. Most other countries it usually does require 1/3 to 1/2 of a "middle class" income to feed a family. (There are a couple of exceptions...Hugo Chavez has made groceries cheap in his country)

I am not saying that there aren't poor in America or that we shouldn't give to them...just that we have the richest poor in the world. Giving to the poor here in America will not end poverty in America...no matter how much they are given. Nor will it end in any other part of the world. These are the rules of the game as determined by God.

But...I would say that not all those that are considered "poor" are;... as well as many that believe themselves to be either middle class or wealthy are as well off as they believe themselves to be either.

Me?

I may be broke but I ain't poor.

[Shellie]

"why dont we take care of our own?"

Lord, who is my neighbor?

[one love]

I have a question to those who seem to have a heart felt burden for the work here in America... What are you personally and your local church doing to feed the hungry here?
To neglect 3rd world counties would be shameful, PG is right, if we do not help them no one will. Those hungry here in America have a goverment that offers some help and plenty of churches that could step up to the plate if the burden is there. There are men, women and children starving in places like W. Va and Ky hills, even in the city streets from LA to NYC. Wanna make a difference? Get your local church involved in food banks, food drives, community outreaches, ect. What are you doing to make America a better place to live?

Brother I think you made a mistake here NOBODY said neglect the poor in 3rd world countries only that MOST churches have neglected those here at home. Both should be done.

[one love]

...the poor American and the addict American has choices and is actually rich in the world's eyes and so we shall move onto the "3rd" world. I'm sorry, but I drove through downtown Nashville today and saw 3rd world. Post all the pics you want, it does not change the fact of the matter.

Do you make $25,000+ annually? If so, you are in the 10th percentile of the world's population... 90% of the world lives on far less.

Nashville? 3rd world? Danny, I hate to hear you make such statements that make others think you foolish. There are flush toilets in Nashville, even available to the poor. There are rescue missions, social welfare agencies, ambulances that will take the indigent to Vandy ER for FREE treatment (Federal Law), and a hundred other things that give the Nashville poor advantages over 3rd world poor. The "poor" in Nashville eat better out of dumpsters than the poor in Calcutta eat period. You don't get it, because you think "America first." I say America AND the 3rd world poor.

I get it perfectly and I agree many in this nation have MUCH better options that the 3rd world do not have. I never heard anyone say "Dont feed the third world" only that we should not forget those here at home as well. That is love, feeding those around the world as you are doing and also getting the help of our churches to feed America.

I love how we talk about options then say it is wrong politically..

[one love]

We in America have some of the richest poor in the world. There are none that go naked. Hunger and homelessness is usually a matter of chemical dependancy and/or mental illness...not anything else. I have worked with and ministered to the homeless here in America and know only full well that for most of them it is simply a choice. They are homeless for a variety of reasons...but mostly it boils down to choice...theirs as to why they are where they are...not any other reason. Granted they can usually tell some colorful and heart wrenching stories here in America...but the truth is something different than the stories they tell.

John, I pray the Lord is more understanding with you than you are with the people of Appalachia. I read in your Roll Call post that you have ministered to the homeless, and all the various places that you have lived. My guess is that this ministry took place within an urban environment. You might very well be correct as to your assesment of the root cause of thiose homeless that you have come in contact with. However, I would ask you to get out of your comfort zone, get off the Interstate and get into the deep back woods in the hills and mountains of Appalachia. It's a whole different world outside the city John. Come face to face with what happens when the only industry in an area shuts down. Here is a map showing the poverty rates through out Appalachia:



I don't think that all these people have a dependency problem. Mountain people the world over, with the exception of the Alpine countries, are amoung the poorest of all the worlds people. The people of Appalachia are no different. Here are two pictures:



One is in Napal the other is in Appalachia, I don't see very much difference. Do You?


TW

which if I am correct it is about 111 counties

[DeWayneTN]

I think if you have a burden for helping the poor of this nation, Godspeed! Don't anyone or anything get in your way. At the same time, don't think that ministry is any more or less important than what's going on elsewhere.

[one love]

I think if you have a burden for helping the poor of this nation, Godspeed! Don't anyone or anything get in your way. At the same time, don't think that ministry is any more or less important than what's going on elsewhere.

AMEN!

[Gerald Creasy]

I think if you have a burden for helping the poor of this nation, Godspeed! Don't anyone or anything get in your way. At the same time, don't think that ministry is any more or less important than what's going on elsewhere.

But.....but...won't it make my halo more shiny if I help the starving poor rather than the simply exceedingly hungy poor!????

[Tim Elston]

But.....but...won't it make my halo more shiny if I help the starving poor rather than the simply exceedingly hungy poor!????

This thread started out with the assumption that it would be better to feed America's poor first and that it is hypocritical to send money overseas short of that. Now here is scorn for the notion of comparing the two.

If we wait for poverty to disappear in America, we will never help anyone but ourselves. Even the publicans do that.

[rough_rider]

I have a question to those who seem to have a heart felt burden for the work here in America... What are you personally and your local church doing to feed the hungry here?
To neglect 3rd world counties would be shameful, PG is right, if we do not help them no one will. Those hungry here in America have a goverment that offers some help and plenty of churches that could step up to the plate if the burden is there. There are men, women and children starving in places like W. Va and Ky hills, even in the city streets from LA to NYC. Wanna make a difference? Get your local church involved in food banks, food drives, community outreaches, ect. What are you doing to make America a better place to live?

Brother I think you made a mistake here NOBODY said neglect the poor in 3rd world countries only that MOST churches have neglected those here at home. Both should be done.

Really? You may be right Brother, but this statement seemed to point that way.

Wouldn't the Western Church be better served to help those in our front yard first? I mean it almost looks hypocritical when we send our money elsewhere.

[rjjunior]

A few snippets taken from www.realtruth.org

Of America's "poor":

43% own their homes.

The “average home owned by persons classified as poor by the Census Bureau is a three-bedroom house with one-and-a-half baths, a garage, and a porch or patio.”

They have significantly more “living space” than does the average citizen living in affluent international cities such as London, Paris, Vienna and Athens. Only 6% of those living below America’s poverty line reported their living conditions as being “overcrowded.”

Next, consider that most today take pleasure in amenities that were considered luxuries just a generation or two ago. For instance, of the 37 million labeled “poor” in the U.S., 80% enjoy the comforts of air-conditioning, as opposed to only 36% of the entire population in 1970.

America’s “poor” are also swimming in technology-related goods and services:

97% own color televisions (over half have two or more)

63% have either cable or satellite access

Over 99% have refrigerators

73% own microwave ovens

One in three households have automatic dishwashers

One-third have cell phones, landline phones and telephone answering machines—less than a paltry 10% “survive” without telephone service at all.

Almost three-quarters own a car and—more surprisingly—over 30% own two cars or more!

For their take on global poverty: http://www.realtruth.org/articles/08032 ... onomy.html

(not an endorsement of this organization, btw.)