Bible Guy

[RamboPreacher]

scooter wrote:

Mexico? Mexico? Are you kidding me?

I didn't say Columbia because I didn't want people to know that I knew what I was talking about. Work with me here.

do they still have special sticks from Thailand?

[Brian]

Here's my point from the beginning... I think that everything should be examined. The path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.

Maybe you grew up being taught that it was a sin to chew gum, and cut your hair. Maybe you were taught that any jewelry is sinful. Maybe you were taught that it is ok to have a glass of wine with your meals. Dipping snuff was common among Christian pilgrims, as was drinking ale. Some churches had "smoke breaks" 60 years ago.

Were these positions wrong? Were they biblical? Maybe, maybe not. But if we care anything about going on unto perfection, if we care about there arising "a glorious Church, without spot or wrinkle, or any such thing," WE MUST examine EVERYTHING by the word.

I asked a simple question. Everyone assumed I was making an accusation, which I guess is fine.

Paul said, “Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?” (2 Cor. 13:5).

Now, legalism fails because some rules may not apply to all. There was no general prohibition against the consumption of alcohol for the children of Israel, but the Rechabites had promised their father that they would never drink. IF THEY DRANK it would have been sin. Some things are universal, but in other cases what is sin for one, may not be for all.

“For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things” (1 John 3:20). So, one person may feel convicted in his heart about something, and so it is sin for him.

On the other hand, some things require teaching to be recognized as against God's will. Adam & Eve thought that their attempt to cover their nakedness was sufficient, but God said that it wasn't, and gave them coats to cover more. So Paul says that the younger women need to be taught to be discreet. Why, because just how much skin is too much is not necessarily instinctively understood.

I for one long for God to have a glorious church without spot or wrinkle, and am not afraid to look again at my customs, my practices, my doctrine, etc., comparing it to God's word, as the path shines brighter and brighter.

Hey bibleguy, when you say "everything" do you really mean "everything" or just some things? Obviously you don't suppose God cares if you use Dial body wash as opposed to Zest. Or maybe that your having taco's for dinner or burger king. Or that you bought the blue sedan over the red corvette.(unless its a bad finacial move lol) Of course you see that some things are just within our human free will to partake of without necessarily picking apart and examining every minute detail. Is it possible to do yoga stretches without engauging in easern mystic patices? Or course you can bibleguy, my wife does yoga here at home, yoga matt and all that, but she meditaes on the goodness of God and the blessings He has given to our family. She rests. She relaxes. Nothing more, nothing mystic about it.

When you asked if certain things were wrong and said "maybe, maybe not" you admit that there is a presumed criteria of accepted /nonaccepted pactices. And rightfully so. There most definately is a standard that Christ commands us to live by but too many times we scoff at the liberty that Christ offers and call it excuses. It is not an excuse to EXPLAIN the liberty that some have and to share that liberty with the accusitory position you have taken when you casts ones personal relationship to Christ in question.

God is also the God of the Asian/Eastern people. He is the God of the Russian mountain dweller who accepted His free gift. He is the God of the south american migrate worker who found Jesus at a tent meeting in a town he was working in. And His Spirit can also be found in there cultures and histories if that individual is filled with the Spirit of God and walking in His perfect will. That is the position that many missionaries took when meeting up with all the "savages" around the world. Every christian doesn't look like your all american boy from 1950's middle America. Christians also wear kimonos and pa'u hula skirts, and quite possibly the converted tribemans from somewhere on the Amazon wear very little at all.
These people are quite different than you or I bibleguy, but I believe that many of them may be a better more faithful follower of Christ than I ever will be.

God bless

[bibleguy]

Certainly God should be involved in every aspect of the believer's life. We are told to be thankful in everything (1 Thess. 5:18). If you bought a car, you might be thanking God, while at the same time He's thinking, "You never asked me if you should buy that one or not."

God expressed His will in so many facets of our lives in the O.T. While we are not bound by the law today, to assume that God has no opinion in some matters is to deny the simple fact that we, being made in His image, have opinions about absolutely EVERYTHING: whether the store smells good, whether the line is moving too slow, whether the car looks pretty, whether that person is too fat, too skinny, too ugly, too proud, whether the school is doing a good job, or the president, or if the streets are well maintained, or the what type of music is appealing... EVERYTHING.

God showed Himself to be likewise throughout the Scriptures, leaving nothing out.

As to the soap, whether one brand or another, God was a big fan of hygiene. Does He care whether we use anti-bacterial or not? I imagine He knows the answer to the debate as to whether anti-bacterial soap helps cause super-resistant bacteria or not, and therefore He probably does care one way or another.

David said, "All my ways are before thee" (Psa. 119:168).

When my wife asks me which dress she should wear, the red or the blue, I may prefer one or the other, or honestly be neutral. She, knowing that I COULD have an opinion might ask me what it is. Today's Christian quickly assumes that God doesn't care about most things, so we presume to do whatever we want. BUT, WE HAVE AN OPINION about what we wear, what we listen to, what we watch, what we drive, where we live, right? Why do we presume that God does not?

He may not care one way or another... but He MIGHT. Shouldn't we put it before Him? Shouldn't we consider that He might have a will for our lives that is more than merely for us to get saved? There is the good and acceptable will, and perfect will of God.

That is not to say you need to pray to make sure that it's okay to tie your shoes. (But I bet God thinks it's a good idea that you do, as the Scripture says, “Then shalt thou walk in thy way safely, and thy foot shall not stumble” - Proverbs 3:23)

[RamboPreacher]

is it God's will that I fold or wad?
further then, if it is His will for one or the other, then shouldn't it be dogmatically stated for all to follow His will in that area?

[pastorables]

I respect your approach pastorables, but still feel that in all the buzz to justify the activity in question, no particular scripture was offered. Fine, maybe I don't deserve a Bible answer, but I believe that there should still be one.

I can appreciate your desire to have a scriptural answer for everything, but the plain truth is that there isn't a direct scriptural address to all of life's individual questions concerning any given issue, moral or immoral. Concerning these unaddressed issues, we must live by grace and do our best not to sin against our conscience.

It seems the scriptures that you seek mostly deal with questions regarding amusements, places, events, etc, and whether they are right or wrong for the Christian to partake. From experience, I've learned that holiness is not something we can manufacture, but rather a reflection of his indwelling Spirit.

There are some things that I may be able to give you a direct scripture for and other things that I can't give you an easy biblical instruction.

Being a minister of God's word, It is certainly not my intention to avoid scripture. If you have specific questions that can be answered with a direct scripture, I will do my best to present it for discussion. Nevertheless, I have found more times than not the Bible is somewhat silent on many of our questions.

Blessings,
pa

[one love]

Bible guy if you are simply stating to place things in our life before God to see if it is acceptable or not, I agree and can understand.
There are many things I dont do that many would call legalistic but I see it in his word and also I have to "work out my own salvation" on matters I am not sure of and let the spirit lead me.
I think I am understanding you but I have not read every post.
It seems that you just want to please the Lord with all aspects of your life and feel that many things that should not be accepted are now accepted because they use "christian _______" before it, I agree.
Holiness has become just a saying to many....
It seems as if many people feel nothing is wrong any longer, there is no difference between the unsaved and the saved (per se) just a proclamation.

So we may disagree on some aspects and agree on others. If I have misunderstood feel free to correct me.

[bibleguy]

You know, something just occurred to me...

I have been posting on 2 separate threads here recently that are seemingly completely unrelated to each other. But then ... it clicked:

I commented that we are too quick to take offense, as evindenced by the recent comments made by Obama (not one of my favorite people, mind you), comparing his poor bowling score to the Special Olympics. I suggested that he be cut a little slack. He did not make the comment to be cruel or hurtful, rather he was making fun of himself, and meant the comment to be in light humor. But I was called to the carpet by virtually everyone else that I was dead wrong. We can't have people making fun of stuff in that way. We can't cut people any slack. He MUST apologize for his words!! We must be dogmatic!!!!

Then, I made a suggestion as to the possibility that some seemingly inocuous activity might be better avoided, and BAM!!! I am again put in my place for being too dogmatic. That because there is no intent to do these things (karate, yoga, christmas trees, etc.) with any pagan worship in mind, they are therefore fair game.

Then there are attempts to brand me a hypocrite, by folks trying to see if I use the word "Monday."

I am seeing a double standard here myself. If we're doing things, it's okay as long as we consider that our intent is okay. But if someone does something that we don't like (in this case, Obama) regardless of his intent, he is out of line and must make things right.

Hmmm....

[one love]

You know, something just occurred to me...

I have been posting on 2 separate threads here recently that are seemingly completely unrelated to each other. But then ... it clicked:

I commented that we are too quick to take offense, as evindenced by the recent comments made by Obama (not one of my favorite people, mind you), comparing his poor bowling score to the Special Olympics. I suggested that he be cut a little slack. He did not make the comment to be cruel or hurtful, rather he was making fun of himself, and meant the comment to be in light humor. But I was called to the carpet by virtually everyone else that I was dead wrong. We can't have people making fun of stuff in that way. We can't cut people any slack. He MUST apologize for his words!! We must be dogmatic!!!!

Then, I made a suggestion as to the possibility that some seemingly inocuous activity might be better avoided, and BAM!!! I am again put in my place for being too dogmatic. That because there is no intent to do these things (karate, yoga, christmas trees, etc.) with any pagan worship in mind, they are therefore fair game.

Then there are attempts to brand me a hypocrite, by folks trying to see if I use the word "Monday."

I am seeing a double standard here myself. If we're doing things, it's okay as long as we consider that our intent is okay. But if someone does something that we don't like (in this case, Obama) regardless of his intent, he is out of line and must make things right.

Hmmm....

well put

[Pastor Bill]

Bibleguy, you want a biblical answer for something that you have not provided a biblical answer against.

Give me a biblical answer on why you tie your shoes or choose to wear a blue shirt over a green one.

Some things are personal preferences and are not specifically addressed biblically. In those things we are to use some common sense and personal judgement. This was not a debate on this topic till you turned it into one, and yes people jumped to the defense of a young boy and his proud father.

[EagerBeaver]

I put Vinaigrette on my salad last night rather than thousand island.

I know there's no scripture evidence for it but God straight up told me to do it.

[fezzik]

I put Vinaigrette on my salad last night rather than thousand island.

I know there's no scripture evidence for it but God straight up told me to do it.

God has cattle on a thousand islands...clearly you are a heretic for using vinaigrette and everybody knows oil and vinagar don't mix.

[Pastor Bill]

I put Vinaigrette on my salad last night rather than thousand island.

I know there's no scripture evidence for it but God straight up told me to do it.

Reminds me of an old Mike Warnke skit:

You can't just say anything anymore, but you have to have a spiritual reason. You can't just say your hungry anymore people will challenge you...

"Oh the spirit of gluttony, cast the demon of secret sauce out of that man"
"Name thyself foul spirit" "Wendy, and Hardee's in here too, won't cause you no trouble to throw us up!"

No you have to say it differently [good old fashion preaching voice] "As I lay sleeping, an angel of the Lord appeared unto me, and said, go, take thyself from thy recumbant and horizontal position unto the world of men, and there high unto the land of the Golden Arches. Whenst thou hast arrived purchase unto thyself two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun, and be ye filled in my name"[/good old fashion preaching voice]

Then you'll not only have them going with you, but you'll get a witness "Oh yes, it's Jesus!..."

[bibleguy]

I put Vinaigrette on my salad last night rather than thousand island.

I know there's no scripture evidence for it but God straight up told me to do it.

Reminds me of an old Mike Warnke skit:

You can't just say anything anymore, but you have to have a spiritual reason. You can't just say your hungry anymore people will challenge you...

"Oh the spirit of gluttony, cast the demon of secret sauce out of that man"
"Name thyself foul spirit" "Wendy, and Hardee's in here too, won't cause you no trouble to throw us up!"

No you have to say it differently [good old fashion preaching voice] "As I lay sleeping, an angel of the Lord appeared unto me, and said, go, take thyself from thy recumbant and horizontal position unto the world of men, and there high unto the land of the Golden Arches. Whenst thou hast arrived purchase unto thyself two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun, and be ye filled in my name"[/good old fashion preaching voice]

Then you'll not only have them going with you, but you'll get a witness "Oh yes, it's Jesus!..."

This proves my point about the whole Obama/Special Olympics thing. When I said, "Man, You can't just say anything anymore..." everyone said, "THAT'S RIGHT!" You all said, if someone might get offended or hurt, then you should just shut your mouth. Now, you're mocking me with the same argument that was invalid when I used it?

Maybe if I had cited someone else, like "You know, that ol' Mike Warnke skit said, 'Man, you can't just say anything anymore,'" it would'nt have been so easily dismissed.

And somehow I'm the hypocrite. Funny.

[TW]

You know, something just occurred to me...

I have been posting on 2 separate threads here recently that are seemingly completely unrelated to each other. But then ... it clicked:

I commented that we are too quick to take offense, as evindenced by the recent comments made by Obama (not one of my favorite people, mind you), comparing his poor bowling score to the Special Olympics. I suggested that he be cut a little slack. He did not make the comment to be cruel or hurtful, rather he was making fun of himself, and meant the comment to be in light humor. But I was called to the carpet by virtually everyone else that I was dead wrong. We can't have people making fun of stuff in that way. We can't cut people any slack. He MUST apologize for his words!! We must be dogmatic!!!!

You wouldn't be employed as a "Spin Doctor," would you? Go back and re-read your post in the other threads, then tell me how you twisted it to this. Going from the one that said we shouldn't be offended to being the victim of a double standard, . . . amazing.


TW
Then, I made a suggestion as to the possibility that some seemingly inocuous activity might be better avoided, and BAM!!! I am again put in my place for being too dogmatic. That because there is no intent to do these things (karate, yoga, christmas trees, etc.) with any pagan worship in mind, they are therefore fair game.

Then there are attempts to brand me a hypocrite, by folks trying to see if I use the word "Monday."

I am seeing a double standard here myself. If we're doing things, it's okay as long as we consider that our intent is okay. But if someone does something that we don't like (in this case, Obama) regardless of his intent, he is out of line and must make things right.

Hmmm....

[Pastor Bill]

This proves my point about the whole Obama/Special Olympics thing. When I said, "Man, You can't just say anything anymore..." everyone said, "THAT'S RIGHT!" You all said, if someone might get offended or hurt, then you should just shut your mouth. Now, you're mocking me with the same argument that was invalid when I used it?

Maybe if I had cited someone else, like "You know, that ol' Mike Warnke skit said, 'Man, you can't just say anything anymore,'" it would'nt have been so easily dismissed.

And somehow I'm the hypocrite. Funny.

Sorry, I wasn't a part of that discussion. So I don't know what was said and what wasn't. I barely skimmed that thread.