Worldwide Currency

[dolfan]

"Truth beyond the written word." See, I understand Scooter's point, but I don't think there is any truth beyond the written word. All that is, was or ever will be rises and falls on the Word. But, let's remember that the Word is a Person. The written truth, the written word, is a description of the relationship between God and His creation. It is an exhaustive description, at least it is sufficiently so for our understanding. It is not, though, and it doesn't purport to be (far as I know) an exhaustive statement of that relationship. It describes God and His relationship with us, but it doesn't list out everything that God may do in relation to it. So, there's the rub, as I see it. What you're saying is "the truth", and sola scriptura, Scooter and Pastorables and lots of others would say (and I apologize if I'm wrong in laying out your view here, so please forgive me) is not the whole truth, that God acts still because He is alive and we're here and alive and that those words spoken and written and committed to paper so long ago do not fully state what God does now. They describe with all of God's inspiration -- truthfully so -- God's relationship to His creation, but that does not limit God to a certain set of finite available actions that He must now use.

I don't think, Gerald, that you would go that far, either. But, when Ritchie says preachers have been preaching this for 50 years, he's saying that Godly men can be moved on by God to consistently and over time point to a truth -- in this case, a future prophetic prediction -- and that that influence of God (which is consistent with the description of His relationship with His creation in the Bible) is now truthfully manifesting, or so it appears.

Now, the issue I would take with that is that such is too much guesswork. That's my problem with dispensationalism and the whole futurist view. There's too much guesswork. Too many interpretations of minute and vast portions of biblical text, pieced together in rather (IMO) slipshod fashion and cobbled into a so-called eschatology. A popularity of that view, and trends of people agreeing on the import of something going on in the world, really don't mean anything. There is, and I think you'd agree, a total absence of any sort of similar feature in the NT narrative. In other words, there is no example in the description of God's relationship with us where people inspired by God, en masse or in smaller groups or trends, take notice of a particular development or phenomenon, and rightly peg that as something that "God is doing", i.e., a prophetic statement. That, to me, says more against the kind of thing that we're talking about here about people's teaching about one-world this or that as being maybe understood as a "move of God" or what-have-you than the fact that someone might describe is as a "truth beyond the written word". In that case, at least as I understand it, it isn't a truth at all. It is, for lack of a better phrase, a shot in the light --- motivated well by well-meaning people who are sincere and God-seeking, but just kind of reaching for it in terms of fact. And, if it isn't truth, then the issue can't be whether it is "beyond the written word." It just isn't -- period.

But, let's take another example that falls in the opposite direction. Let's say that in the course of a meeting of believers, someone has a sudden knowledge, not of his own study or observation but truly just dropped into awareness by the Holy Spirit, but someone suddenly "knows" X. Let's say X is a sin committed by JoeBobJimmyJohn. Well, it is in the NT narrative that God relates to His human creation by providing such knowledge for a specific purpose. One was rebuke (Ananias and Sapphira). God has used other means to accomplish less, shall we say, permanent goals. So, He could use that same means (sudden knowledge) for another purpose (encouragement, correction, faith building, etc.). If that happened, we can't find a specific instance in Scripture where those elements combined, perhaps, but we find God's relationship with us described in sufficiently plentiful and specific ways that we can just know (because we are guided, in fact, by Him) that the written word demonstrates the truth of it. That may be a "truth beyond the written word" in a mechanical sense where the example is not precisely patterned in the NT record. It is not, though, beyond the written word because God has already plainly and clearly described His relationship with us so that we can, in truth, expect Him to do exactly such things as this.

[MacUser]

world currency,

Doesnt is make sense to have the world opeating on the same economic system?

Dollar Falls Most in Month as China Urges New Reserve Currency
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... .zWVPnOYYg

My issue is that it's all aimed at harming the USA in the process.
I am a citizen of the US and not the world. My freedoms come from America and not the world.

[Full Quiver]

India is establishing a database to keep track of all their citizens. It will be the world's second largest db. China has the largest and they supposedly have all their citizens in that database.

[dolfan]

This language, in response to MacUser's lament, which I share, is what gets me at the heart:

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

It seems to me, personally, that it is time to exercise "the right of the people to alter or abolish" the form of Government we now have and "to institute new Government." I think abolishing, truly, is the only answer, and that we must split the continent among people of varying views and have a multi-state solution, to borrow a phrase. I know we already have 50 states, but really we don't. We have 50 provinces and one central government telling them all what to do on the most important aspects of civilized life. It is time to end that arrangement.

[beckrl]

Do we not believe in the gift of Prophecy?
Do all prophecy have a written place in the bible?
Will God reveal those thinks that were shut up in Daniel's vision?

[dolfan]

Wrong question, honestly.

Do you believe that the exercise of the gift of prophecy must be accountable to some standard of biblical truth? If so, what is that standard? Define it, lay it out.

For myself, yes I accept that the NT says that God gave some to be prophets in the NT church. In those NT examples of prophetic statements (by that I mean predictive prophecy), they are quite specific. Cryptic? Sure. What I don't see, though, in the NT is a pattern of predictions that become "prophetic" by reason of popular acceptance or repetition. That's what passes for prophetic nowadays, I'm afraid, and it is part of what Gerald is railing against.

[soulsearcher]

It seems to me, personally, that it is time to exercise "the right of the people to alter or abolish" the form of Government we now have and "to institute new Government." I think abolishing, truly, is the only answer, and that we must split the continent among people of varying views and have a multi-state solution, to borrow a phrase. I know we already have 50 states, but really we don't. We have 50 provinces and one central government telling them all what to do on the most important aspects of civilized life. It is time to end that arrangement.

Why does this seem so attractive to me?

How/where would the continent be split?

[scooter]

Does not the "truth beyond" give liscense to Mary as Co-mediatrix, Praying to saints, paedobaptism, additionl gospels, and even in the case of Reading NT prophecy believing the 144 thousand are the ONLY people who are going to be saved?

Response: Reframing the topic to include drastic untruths really doesn't extend the discussion.

I'm not advocating any untruth.

I'm only saying that there are things that are truth that transcend the finite written word.

I think that before the post descended into "you jokers are a bunch of mormom loving pope ring kissing supposed elect jehovah witnesses heretics", it was about preachers preaching something years ago than now looks plausible.

It is biblical that the Spirit of the Lord would move upon and through individuals to relay future events. That is unless you resign God, through the Holy Spirit to "the bible says".

I find that the exact spiritless dead letter religion that grips much of the modern church.

That is not to say that I agree with any untruth or perversion.

How do we tell the difference? By knowing the book and the author.

[JohnDB]

Dolfan could be quite correct. That all of the elements and Characters of the final Eschaton are on stage and playing out their prospective roles at this moment...but that the truth of the scriptures is ignored and the symbolisms used are simply misdiagnosed.

The one world currency concept isnt new. We have a world bank and an exchange rate of every legitimate currency in the world. I can purchase items in US dollars or Swiss Francs in any stock exchange in the world...all from the convenience of my home. (thanks to the internet)

The Book of Revelations wasn't written to or about unbelievers...it was written to a few believers about the days and times soon to come. Eon being a very loose definition for day/month/year/century/millenium.

Here is the rub though...if you are ready today...then don't sweat it. Hold fast to Whom you believe in and don't give up. Put on the full armor of God as described in Ephesians 6...noticing that this weaponry isn't for attack...it is for withstanding being attacked so that we can continue to serve.
As long as we "get that part" we will be just fine...the battle and war is already won...we just got to wait for the plunder.

[Gerald Creasy]

Does not the "truth beyond" give liscense to Mary as Co-mediatrix, Praying to saints, paedobaptism, additionl gospels, and even in the case of Reading NT prophecy believing the 144 thousand are the ONLY people who are going to be saved?

Response: Reframing the topic to include drastic untruths really doesn't extend the discussion.

I'm not advocating any untruth.

I'm only saying that there are things that are truth that transcend the finite written word.

I think that before the post descended into "you jokers are a bunch of mormom loving pope ring kissing supposed elect jehovah witnesses heretics", it was about preachers preaching something years ago than now looks plausible.

It is biblical that the Spirit of the Lord would move upon and through individuals to relay future events. That is unless you resign God, through the Holy Spirit to "the bible says".

I find that the exact spiritless dead letter religion that grips much of the modern church.

That is not to say that I agree with any untruth or perversion.

How do we tell the difference? By knowing the book and the author.

You missed my point entirely and it was not reframed at all.

If you accept "just a little" over and above the scripture there is no governing factor to keep you from accepting "a whole lot". You have eliminated Scripture as the governing factor.

You say "knowing the book and the author" but you know as well as I that that differs from one denomination to the next, from one person to the next....there are those that embrace all manner of devilish doctrines upon the claim that they know the book and the author better than the next.

And what is difference between "knowing the book" and standing by the statement "THAT is not found in scripture; therefore I will not believe it"?

For the sake of discussion Let us follow your logic:

1) Something Is preached
2) Something comes to pass
3) Because it was preached and come to pass it is READ BACK INTO SCRIPTURE.
4) The truth of Scripture is therefore detemined and defined.


If this is true we have NO WAY of knowing whether anything we believe in the Bible is true or not because someone could come along and preach an ideology in the year 2057, by 2100 it looks like it's coming to pass, and even though that ideology has no scripture it is READ BACK IN.

Therefore the people of 2100 would have the more true scripture than we today.


THIS is what is claimed by "one world currency" and "one world government", before John Nelson Darby in the 1800s and the use of these ideas in the Scofield Study Bible these ideas were not believed or "guessed at" (since theres no scripture).

Those poor saps that Revelations Was written to never had a chance to make heads nor tales of it (in other words it was nonsense) because Darby wasnt born for another 1800 years.

[scooter]

Does not the "truth beyond" give liscense to Mary as Co-mediatrix, Praying to saints, paedobaptism, additionl gospels, and even in the case of Reading NT prophecy believing the 144 thousand are the ONLY people who are going to be saved?

Response: Reframing the topic to include drastic untruths really doesn't extend the discussion.

I'm not advocating any untruth.

I'm only saying that there are things that are truth that transcend the finite written word.

I think that before the post descended into "you jokers are a bunch of mormom loving pope ring kissing supposed elect jehovah witnesses heretics", it was about preachers preaching something years ago than now looks plausible.

It is biblical that the Spirit of the Lord would move upon and through individuals to relay future events. That is unless you resign God, through the Holy Spirit to "the bible says".

I find that the exact spiritless dead letter religion that grips much of the modern church.

That is not to say that I agree with any untruth or perversion.

How do we tell the difference? By knowing the book and the author.

You missed my point entirely and it was not reframed at all.

If you accept "just a little" over and above the scripture there is no governing factor to keep you from accepting "a whole lot". You have eliminated Scripture as the governing factor.

You say "knowing the book and the author" but you know as well as I that that differs from one denomination to the next, from one person to the next....there are those that embrace all manner of devilish doctrines upon the claim that they know the book and the author better than the next.

And what is difference between "knowing the book" and standing by the statement "THAT is not found in scripture; therefore I will not believe it"?

For the sake of discussion Let us follow your logic:

1) Something Is preached
2) Something comes to pass
3) Because it was preached and come to pass it is READ BACK INTO SCRIPTURE.
4) The truth of Scripture is therefore detemined and defined.


If this is true we have NO WAY of knowing whether anything we believe in the Bible is true or not because someone could come along and preach an ideology in the year 2057, by 2100 it looks like it's coming to pass, and even though that ideology has no scripture it is READ BACK IN.

Therefore the people of 2100 would have the more true scripture than we today.


THIS is what is claimed by "one world currency" and "one world government", before John Nelson Darby in the 1800s and the use of these ideas in the Scofield Study Bible these ideas were not believed or "guessed at" (since theres no scripture).

Those poor saps that Revelations Was written to never had a chance to make heads nor tales of it (in other words it was nonsense) because Darby wasnt born for another 1800 years.

Response: I didn't miss anything only that you end ran reality right out of the box to argue against your perception. Despite the FACT that the post was started as a discussion about one thing you REFRAMED it to be about another and then imagine people are arguing against your point.

I will say this though, who do you think understood captivity better those who heard it preached or those who lived it as a captive? Which generation understood the time of Christ better those to whom it was preached or those whose hearts burned within them as He was revealed in the flesh? Or even the subsequent generations who have many more pieces of the puzzle?

[one love]

does not the mark of the beast represent some sort of one world currency? The bible says you can not buy or sell with out that mark. I am just curious. I recently studied a thought of one world order etc..

[pastorables]

does not the mark of the beast represent some sort of one world currency? The bible says you can not buy or sell with out that mark. I am just curious. I recently studied a thought of one world order etc..

That's just it. Those men of old, some without formal educations, believed that it did. They interpreted the Bible to the best of their knowledge and ability just as we do today. I find it very interesting that the things they preached and passed down are actually being discussed in world news today.

pa

[Gerald Creasy]

Response: I didn't miss anything only that you end ran reality right out of the box to argue against your perception. Despite the FACT that the post was started as a discussion about one thing you REFRAMED it to be about another and then imagine people are arguing against your point.

You must be watching an entirely different thread than the one I am.


I am responding to the claims that have been made: It was preached, it is asked for by obscured governments (not fulfilled at ALL PAstor Ables) and therefore it HAS TO BE SCRIPTURE.

IS this not the issue that is being discussed?

[Gerald Creasy]

does not the mark of the beast represent some sort of one world currency? The bible says you can not buy or sell with out that mark. I am just curious. I recently studied a thought of one world order etc..

But did you study the Bible?


Why is the Mark of the Beast on the forehead a literal thing that must include a one world Government and a one world currency (both of which arent there), when God said FIRST that he would put his mark upon the forehead of HIS people?

Why is Gods mark spiritual and the Beasts Mark literal?

Using the Bible as the RULE, Would not the OBVIOUS conclusion be that the Beasts mark was the negative counterpart of Gods rather than an additional Idea of a One World Government and One World Currency be CREATED and INSERTED into the scripture??

And Playing the game: Theres more alternatives than a "one world Currency" that answers the question of why someone couldnt buy or sell.
Any reason you create can be inserted into scripture (since one world currency is, why not anything else).