Should we Torture Prisoners to Obtain Information??

[MacUser]

But then I ask myself 'Could I carry it out? Could I torture another human being?' And my response is always 'No, I couldn't'. The ability to really torture another human being I think would singify to me that I had lost something of what it means to be human.

If your child or loved one was going to be killed, harmed, tortured and you prayed for a solution to this... and the individual responsible or partners were delivered into your hands.

I would call that answered prayer.

[Brandon Bowers]

I can't even go hunting, so I don't think I could torture someone... Unless they've hurt my family.. Then it'll be the worst thing anyone could ever imagine.

[Russell Roberts]

But then I ask myself 'Could I carry it out? Could I torture another human being?' And my response is always 'No, I couldn't'. The ability to really torture another human being I think would singify to me that I had lost something of what it means to be human.

If your child or loved one was going to be killed, harmed, tortured and you prayed for a solution to this... and the individual responsible or partners were delivered into your hands.

I would call that answered prayer.

Mac, this is an excellent point. I can't say that I don't have very conflicting emotions about the issue. There is a part of me that rejoices when I watch a movie and see someone getting his just desserts. For example, in 'Man on Fire' there is a scene in which Denzel Washington has a guys hands taped to the steering wheel and is cutting his fingers off'.

Honestly, I felt a great sense of satisfaction to watch this guy get his comeuppance. The hard thing to think through is that I'm not sure which part of me likes this. We long to see justice done but is this what justice looks like? I'm open to different opinions. If this is what justice looks like, how can we square this with the model Jesus provided. I'm pretty sure that he knew his disciples would eventually be slaughtered. Why didn't he stop it? He sure could have.

[MacUser]

The hard thing to think through is that I'm not sure which part of me likes this. We long to see justice done but is this what justice looks like? I'm open

Sure. I fall short often.. but I keep trying like Peter.
Learning more and more what Christ really did on the cross. It's truly liberating.

[Brian]

In my opinion torture isn't something that I think we should do but it may be something that we would do to help protect our loved ones or innocent lives. For me the jury is still out on that because I just don't know.

I don't look at war time situations in the same light as I do other times. (everything has it's time) Not saying that it's ok to do wrong today but not tomorrow, just sayin' there is a time for peace and a time for war.

This is a tough one for me. I would most definately mess someone up if they had my family hostage or harmed in any way. But I am not convinced that is what God would want me to do. Protect my family? YES! But how far should I go? I am not smart enough to know.

[Full Quiver]

Should we Torture Prisoners to Obtain Information??

If they are not American, British, Israeli, or Allied citizens then ABSOLUTELY YES!!!! American citizens have rights and should be treated as you or I, Our allies should be respected if it's one of their own but these Islamic tyrants should be treated no holds barred.

[Russell Roberts]

Should we Torture Prisoners to Obtain Information??

If they are not American, British, Israeli, or Allied citizens then ABSOLUTELY YES!!!! American citizens have rights and should be treated as you or I, Our allies should be respected if it's one of their own but these Islamic tyrants should be treated no holds barred.

Full Quiver, it is a grave mistake to paint the rest of the world black, classifying various groups as 'evil' while ignoring the evil that permeates our own society. If I want to know what is wrong with the church, well...I go look in the mirror. The same thread of evil that runs through my enemy runs through me. We ALL have the capacity for evil.

Many fail to realize that the meta-sin of the Jews was one of ethnocentricity. They believed that their DNA sequence afforded them a 'privilaged nation' status before God when it came time for judgment. Have you ever noticed their boasts in scripture about being 'sons of Abraham'?

We must avoid the same trap of ethnicentricity. Our allegience must be to Jesus Christ and to humanity at large rather than those who simply happened to be born in the same country or who have a similar DNA sequence. Bless you brother.

[Full Quiver]

I am full aware of the evil that lies within every man's reach but a citizen of the USA has rights that non citizens do not have. PERIOD! I don't care what color, language, or corner of the Earth they come from, if they aren't American then they do not get the privilege of our rights being in their favor. See they are rights to us but would be privileges to them IF we awarded them equal treatment. Why would they desire these rights? They for the most part show no concern or desire for such laws and rights in their own society. The only reason they want these laws and rights used in their cases is because they have an outside shot at life and thus carrying on their agenda whether behind bars or back in a cave somewhere half-way around the world.

[Russell Roberts]

What are our rights as Americans based on? Are they not based on the basic principles of human dignity because we were made in God's image? If so, shouldn't these rights be afforded any human being that was also made in His image?

[Brian]

What are our rights as Americans based on? Are they not based on the basic principles of human dignity because we were made in God's image? If so, shouldn't these rights be afforded any human being that was also made in His image?

Absolutely! The Constitution say's that certain rights and principles shall not be infringed upon. Some of those principles the Constitution recognizes as pre-existing endowed by our Creator that laws should not infringe upon. Those rights and principles cover all peoples, not just Americans.

[Russell Roberts]

Brian, thanks for pointing that out.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

[Shellie]

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

I believe the rights the constitution is speaking about here is equal right to opportunity, protection, and the ability to pursue productive things. You cannot convince me that "among these' includes "all" rights, i.e those deemed to be rights by activist groups, were included in the thinking and penning of the Constitution.

I would also like to point out that unalienable rights given by the Creator do not include terroism, murder, and mayhem of innocents.

One more thing....because they were created equal does not necessarily mean that they remain that way. Prisoners do not have equal rights for a reason.

[Russell Roberts]

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

I believe the rights the constitution is speaking about here is equal right to opportunity, protection, and the ability to pursue productive things. You cannot convince me that "among these' includes "all" rights, i.e those deemed to be rights by activist groups, were included in the thinking and penning of the Constitution.

I would also like to point out that unalienable rights given by the Creator do not include terroism, murder, and mayhem of innocents.

One more thing....because they were created equal does not necessarily mean that they remain that way. Prisoners do not have equal rights for a reason.

This is an excellent point Shellie. Rights are ceded based on ones responsible use of those rights. Rights are ceded as a necessary measure to maintain order and control within a society. But even the Geneva Convention affords basic human rights for those captured in a time of war. There comes a point that the issue is no longer about giving up rights but about how we treat those people whose rights have been taken away.

How should we treat them? If we torture them, if we treat them inhumanely, have we not become somthing like them...something less than human? This seems to be opposed to the idea of the self-sacrifical love demonstrated by Jesus.

Again, as I have indicated previously, I feel pretty sure that if it was my own family at risk, I might torture the person. But is this what I should do?

Again, I am certainly open to differing opinions. Are there applicable scriptures that you know of that are enlightening?

[Full Quiver]

The American justice system was intended for Americans.

[Russell Roberts]

I'm not sure if this might help the discussion move along but let's consider one aspect of what appears to be the reasoning of Jesus. The final tool in the arsenal of violence possessed by the Romans was death which we all know Jesus defeated on the cross.

Jesus came announcing the near time arrival of the Kingdom of God (which was apparently breaking in through his ministry) but he rejected the tools in the arsenal of evil. The Jews were sick and tired of being oppressed by the Romans and were ready for a revolt. Despite the common interpretation of the word 'lestes' as 'thieves' it should really be rendered as 'brigand'. When Jesus cleansed the temple he really said that it had become a den of 'brigands'. His polemic was not against those who were simply profiting from setting up a market in the temple but against those who wished to mount a military offensive against Rome.

One more passage that might help is in Phillipians 2 when Paul said that Jesus did not consider his equality with God (in a sense a right) as something to be exploited (grasped) but considered it as uniquely qualifying himself to perform the task at hand - to come to earth and die on a cross to redeem humanity.

I'm just throwing ideas out to help the discussion along. If someone has more insight on these aspects and how they relate to the current topic, PLEASE chime in.