"You lie!" -- Truth to power

[MacUser]

if we cant see that there must be a way to regulate it. unions, gov. whatever it takes to keep the owners and stockholders from taken advantage of the workers. if we dont want the gov. involved we should make strides to be a family friendly company, because its going to happen with or without obama.

Let's flip this a second.. take our local Supercenter for example. What's to protect the owners from the non ethic workers? Our town was the last to get a Supercenter because of the shrinkage of product from the small store ( STEALING OUT THE BACK DOOR ). We finally upgraded to a Supercenter a few years back and the shrinkage has exploded!! So much that a ring was busted of where the LOCAL police officers were even involved in the product removal from the back door!!! These individuals thought it was FAIR and JUSTIFIED to STEAL and REMOVE plasma/lcd TVs, DVDs, BLUERAYs, [insert product here] because of your thinking process. This company didn't have to come to our town.. it didn't have to offer the hundreds of jobs that it does in our community and yet it was deemed wrong and pillaged. Lord help us.

You will pay people much more than 7.25 an hour if you offer a family friendly company. i know we cant talk comp. owners into opening their wallets to give people more if they dont have to. people are driven by money and more time away from the work place. quility time. sat. night time, sunday morning time. health care, raises, sick time. all of these things make employes better workers. proven fact.

So we want to be the GM model? Over 3/4s of the workforce are not working? The Company IS Bankrupt, can't make products that really sell ( from Govt Restrictions ) and now owned by the Govt because of the Unions... Amazing!!

Again.. this can't sustain itself. NOTHING IS FREE. America is in debt up to our eye balls!! But unions don't care.. sign our kids, grandkids up as long as we get that check today.

Beam me up Scotty.

[MacUser]

[i have said those that are working or earning. read, think and then debate.

You advocate STEALING money (taken by force or threat of punishment) from one person that takes risks, family and welfare.... and SENDING it to someone that didn't earn it or risked anything. That is STEALING!

I do think. I do read and I will debate your narrow thinking.

[dawgs10]

if we cant see that there must be a way to regulate it. unions, gov. whatever it takes to keep the owners and stockholders from taken advantage of the workers. if we dont want the gov. involved we should make strides to be a family friendly company, because its going to happen with or without obama.

Let's flip this a second.. take our local Supercenter for example. What's to protect the owners from the non ethic workers? Our town was the last to get a Supercenter because of the shrinkage of product from the small store ( STEALING OUT THE BACK DOOR ). We finally upgraded to a Supercenter a few years back and the shrinkage has exploded!! So much that a ring was busted of where the LOCAL police officers were even involved in the product removal from the back door!!! These individuals thought it was FAIR and JUSTIFIED to STEAL and REMOVE plasma/lcd TVs, DVDs, BLUERAYs, [insert product here] because of your thinking process. This company didn't have to come to our town.. it didn't have to offer the hundreds of jobs that it does in our community and yet it was deemed wrong and pillaged. Lord help us.

You will pay people much more than 7.25 an hour if you offer a family friendly company. i know we cant talk comp. owners into opening their wallets to give people more if they dont have to. people are driven by money and more time away from the work place. quility time. sat. night time, sunday morning time. health care, raises, sick time. all of these things make employes better workers. proven fact.

So we want to be the GM model? Over 3/4s of the workforce are not working? The Company IS Bankrupt, can't make products that really sell ( from Govt Restrictions ) and now owned by the Govt because of the Unions... Amazing!!

Again.. this can't sustain itself. NOTHING IS FREE. America is in debt up to our eye balls!! But unions don't care.. sign our kids, grandkids up as long as we get that check today.

Beam me up Scotty.

again you are not reading or thinking or really debating. just saying the same thing over and over and over again. GM is not in trouble because they spent to much on workers. they are in trouble because they havent built a car or truck anyone wants to buy in years. when they had the best truck in america they sold it and money was there for EVERYONE!! they paid people for a job well done. when they starting designing trucks with a body style that people hated and had way to many styles on the market for the market to bare then they lost huge amounts of money. then they cut back on the people that had no say in what they built. sorry, try again. without saying the samething over and over. bad product management will sink a comp. not good hr practices.

[dawgs10]

although that line of thinking is true, it is not correct. it just is simply not the work force in the united states of america. if someone is making minium wage they will give minium wage effert.

Wow. You must live in a utopian world. I have also owned businesses and employed workers and have never found the work ethic to be increased by raises and bonuses. I could share much about my thoughts on business, but this isn't the time or place.

To the contrary, I always received the "I was owed that and want more" attitude, but never witnessed an increase in production for my business. Likewise, the employees who offered more due to their own work ethic were rewarded.



pa

by answering a clip of what i wrote is no answer at all. and the fact is happy workers make good workers and pay is not the only part of the whole.

[dawgs10]

[i have said those that are working or earning. read, think and then debate.

You advocate STEALING money (taken by force or threat of punishment) from one person that takes risks, family and welfare.... and SENDING it to someone that didn't earn it or risked anything. That is STEALING!

I do think. I do read and I will debate your narrow thinking.

so lets look at it this way. you abuse someone for years. using your private property in this crime. officials step in and say you have commited a crime. not only have you abused people and treated them wrong but you used you property to do it. so we are going to require you to pay recompense for this. ummm!!!!! dont think thats stealing.

[MacUser]

[i have said those that are working or earning. read, think and then debate.

You advocate STEALING money (taken by force or threat of punishment) from one person that takes risks, family and welfare.... and SENDING it to someone that didn't earn it or risked anything. That is STEALING!

I do think. I do read and I will debate your narrow thinking.

so lets look at it this way. you abuse someone for years. using your private property in this crime. officials step in and say you have commited a crime. not only have you abused people and treated them wrong but you used you property to do it. so we are going to require you to pay recompense for this. ummm!!!!! dont think thats stealing.

Ahhh.. So a private business is a Crime if it's not paying the employee the salary that they want? Let me state this again.... slowly this time.. an employee isn't a slave, serf or indentured servant. ( Free Will - No one is held against will etc. )

If that person doesn't like the job they have.. they can quit and find another job that pays what they want.. based on skill level and/or work ethic.

But to the reverse you are proposing that the employer be required (against his will - no option here) to pay more than what the free market demands for such a position?

Beam me up Scotty.

[dawgs10]

[i have said those that are working or earning. read, think and then debate.

You advocate STEALING money (taken by force or threat of punishment) from one person that takes risks, family and welfare.... and SENDING it to someone that didn't earn it or risked anything. That is STEALING!

I do think. I do read and I will debate your narrow thinking.

so lets look at it this way. you abuse someone for years. using your private property in this crime. officials step in and say you have commited a crime. not only have you abused people and treated them wrong but you used you property to do it. so we are going to require you to pay recompense for this. ummm!!!!! dont think thats stealing.

Ahhh.. So a private business is a Crime if it's not paying the employee the salary that they want? Let me state this again.... slowly this time.. an employee isn't a slave, serf or indentured servant. ( Free Will - No one is held against will etc. )

If that person doesn't like the job they have.. they can quit and find another job that pays what they want.. based on skill level and/or work ethic.

But to the reverse you are proposing that the employer be required (against his will - no option here) to pay more than what the free market demands for such a position?

Beam me up Scotty.

again, slowly on my part, free market is not the same as a uncontrolled market and we are in a free controlled market. like it or not. like it or not people that work for others have rights. workers rights have been around for a long time. yes they can quit and go somewhere else but why would a owner want that from a experienced, dedicated, worker. instead why would you not freely make your work place family friendly. your free to work people within the law. the issue is that laws are different from state to state. georgia has one of the worst state protection laws for workers. greedy people take advantage of this. they hire and fire at will while treating people like numbers and cattle. not offering any type of life outside of the work place. bait and switch is used all the time in interviews for jobs. so we should never regulate any type of treatment for workers????? thats insane.

[MacUser]

GM is not in trouble because they spent to much on workers. they are in trouble because they havent built a car or truck anyone wants to buy in years. when they had the best truck in america they sold it and money was there for EVERYONE!! they paid people for a job well done. when they starting designing trucks with a body style that people hated and had way to many styles on the market for the market to bare then they lost huge amounts of money. then they cut back on the people that had no say in what they built. sorry, try again. without saying the samething over and over. bad product management will sink a comp. not good hr practices.

Wrong. They had a failed business model. They were paying for 3/4s of the workforce that didn't show up. How can that survive?? Only 1/4 workforce working. The overpaid union guys retired at 50 and went home with full salary. Again.. being paid for SOMETHING they didn't do. Were executives overpaid? Sure.. but again a failed business model. Even if you remove the executives... the business model was doomed.

The GM union worked such a sweet deal.. that EVEN if GM failed.. the AMERICAN TAX PAYERS are responsible to cover 2/3s of the tab. WHAT? How did that work that crazy deal?? This crazy stuff has to stop. If the business can't pay it (you get zero).. it's not the American peoples fault. Insane.

If Americans can't get the pass this notion of being PAID money for something that they are not doing we are all doomed. That past day is OVER. If you are not working.. you are not owed any money. If you didn't save your money - nobody else owes anything for you living above your means and failing to seek greater employment.

The next thing is local Govt officials and early retirements.... that has to stop also. Paid for no work should be shameful.

[dawgs10]

GM is not in trouble because they spent to much on workers. they are in trouble because they havent built a car or truck anyone wants to buy in years. when they had the best truck in america they sold it and money was there for EVERYONE!! they paid people for a job well done. when they starting designing trucks with a body style that people hated and had way to many styles on the market for the market to bare then they lost huge amounts of money. then they cut back on the people that had no say in what they built. sorry, try again. without saying the samething over and over. bad product management will sink a comp. not good hr practices.

Wrong. They had a failed business model. They were paying for 3/4s of the workforce that didn't show up. How can that survive?? Only 1/4 workforce working. The overpaid union guys retired at 50 and went home with full salary. Again.. being paid for SOMETHING they didn't do. Were executives overpaid? Sure.. but again a failed business model. Even if you remove the executives... the business model was doomed.

The GM union worked such a sweet deal.. that EVEN if GM failed.. the AMERICAN TAX PAYERS are responsible to cover 2/3s of the tab. WHAT? How did that work that crazy deal?? This crazy stuff has to stop. If the business can't pay it (you get zero).. it's not the American peoples fault. Insane.

If Americans can't get the pass this notion of being PAID money for something that they are not doing we are all doomed. That past day is OVER. If you are not working.. you are not owed any money. If you didn't save your money - nobody else owes anything for you living above your means and failing to seek greater employment.

The next thing is local Govt officials and early retirements.... that has to stop also. Paid for no work should be shameful.

you are just wrong!!!! sales in the last 10 years dropped lower than ever before!!!!! no money coming in. whats the answer? build better cars and trucks, NO lets go bankrupt and lay people off!!!! sounds like a failed business model to me.

[MacUser]

2 Thessalonians 3

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?bo ... version=65

13. Don't you remember the rule we had when we lived with you? "If you don't work, you don't eat." And now we're getting reports that a bunch of lazy good-for-nothings are taking advantage of you. This must not be tolerated. We command them to get to work immediately—no excuses, no arguments—and earn their own keep. Friends, don't slack off in doing your duty.

14-15. If anyone refuses to obey our clear command written in this letter, don't let him get by with it. Point out such a person and refuse to subsidize his freeloading. Maybe then he'll think twice. But don't treat him as an enemy. Sit him down and talk about the problem as someone who cares.

16. May the Master of Peace himself give you the gift of getting along with each other at all times, in all ways. May the Master be truly among you!

17. I, Paul, bid you good-bye in my own handwriting. I do this in all my letters, so examine my signature as proof that the letter is genuine.

****

I'm pointing this out..

[dawgs10]

GM is not in trouble because they spent to much on workers. they are in trouble because they havent built a car or truck anyone wants to buy in years. when they had the best truck in america they sold it and money was there for EVERYONE!! they paid people for a job well done. when they starting designing trucks with a body style that people hated and had way to many styles on the market for the market to bare then they lost huge amounts of money. then they cut back on the people that had no say in what they built. sorry, try again. without saying the samething over and over. bad product management will sink a comp. not good hr practices.

Wrong. They had a failed business model. They were paying for 3/4s of the workforce that didn't show up. How can that survive?? Only 1/4 workforce working. The overpaid union guys retired at 50 and went home with full salary. Again.. being paid for SOMETHING they didn't do. Were executives overpaid? Sure.. but again a failed business model. Even if you remove the executives... the business model was doomed.

The GM union worked such a sweet deal.. that EVEN if GM failed.. the AMERICAN TAX PAYERS are responsible to cover 2/3s of the tab. WHAT? How did that work that crazy deal?? This crazy stuff has to stop. If the business can't pay it (you get zero).. it's not the American peoples fault. Insane.

If Americans can't get the pass this notion of being PAID money for something that they are not doing we are all doomed. That past day is OVER. If you are not working.. you are not owed any money. If you didn't save your money - nobody else owes anything for you living above your means and failing to seek greater employment.

The next thing is local Govt officials and early retirements.... that has to stop also. Paid for no work should be shameful.

i do agree that no work equals no pay in most cases. thats the way it should be. you seem to be unwilling to admit that owners do treat many workers unfair and in many cases break the law. they get away with it all the time. letting people go for reasons that will keep people from drawing unemployment on purpose even though its not true. not offering benefits to people that work 34 instead of 35 hours a week on average but many weeks they are made to work 40. forcing people to work holidays without time off and not paying anymore for it. things that can be done but people are just to greedy to do it.

[dawgs10]

2 Thessalonians 3

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?bo ... version=65

13. Don't you remember the rule we had when we lived with you? "If you don't work, you don't eat." And now we're getting reports that a bunch of lazy good-for-nothings are taking advantage of you. This must not be tolerated. We command them to get to work immediately—no excuses, no arguments—and earn their own keep. Friends, don't slack off in doing your duty.

14-15. If anyone refuses to obey our clear command written in this letter, don't let him get by with it. Point out such a person and refuse to subsidize his freeloading. Maybe then he'll think twice. But don't treat him as an enemy. Sit him down and talk about the problem as someone who cares.

16. May the Master of Peace himself give you the gift of getting along with each other at all times, in all ways. May the Master be truly among you!

17. I, Paul, bid you good-bye in my own handwriting. I do this in all my letters, so examine my signature as proof that the letter is genuine.

****


I'm pointing this out..

all true and not being debated. we are talking about people that are working and being misstreated which can be found in col. paul wrote that to.

[MacUser]

i do agree that no work equals no pay in most cases.

I do see it ALL CASES..

you seem to be unwilling to admit that owners do treat many workers unfair and in many cases break the law.

Sure BAD employers exist. Quit that JOB.. find another... as ALL employers are not bad.

In the same idea that employers are bad.. you seem to ignore the idea that some employees are bad as well. Some are Lazy, ineffective and take advantage of the company, unions and... in some extreme cases steal the places blind all being justified by this under paid concept.. when they are JUST THIEVES.

You KNOW you have seen that.

[MacUser]

14-15. If anyone refuses to obey our clear command written in this letter, don't let him get by with it. Point out such a person and refuse to subsidize his freeloading. Maybe then he'll think twice. But don't treat him as an enemy. Sit him down and talk about the problem as someone who cares.

all true and not being debated. we are talking about people that are working and being misstreated which can be found in col. paul wrote that to.

Ahh.. but first we have to define what is freeloading? Refusing to Subsidize it also. Refusing to obey a clear command to work... etc.

Would taking money from some by force and giving it to some else that didn't earn it.. be FREELOADING? If you are being forced.. is that stealing or at it's very least.. subsidizing?

We have to establish these concepts and not be afraid to point them out where ever we find them.

[dawgs10]

i do agree that no work equals no pay in most cases.

I do see it ALL CASES..

you seem to be unwilling to admit that owners do treat many workers unfair and in many cases break the law.

Sure BAD employers exist. Quit that JOB.. find another... as ALL employers are not bad.

In the same idea that employers are bad.. you seem to ignore the idea that some employees are bad as well. Some are Lazy, ineffective and take advantage of the company, unions and... in some extreme cases steal the places blind all being justified by this under paid concept.. when they are JUST THIEVES.

You KNOW you have seen that.

all along i have been speaking about those that are working and doing the job they are being paid for. those that are working with no hope of healthcare and benefits and a private life. those that are living by their means and those that just want more from the company they have given everthing they can give. you can go back and read what i have said. there must be regulations because bad employers are wide spread. it is much worse than most people know. most would rather ignore it because they have what they need. that fact!!!

and fyi there are some cases such as hurt on the job cases where osha and others help with that cant work and should be paid.