The Coming of the Son of Man

Russell Roberts · Postby **Russell Roberts** » January 6th, 2010, 1:38 pm

Here is a recent installation note in a series I posed on Facebook. Ya'll, my beloved homies, give me some FEEDBACK PLEASE!!!

I have plainly stated through this series that there has been a huge misunderstanding about the meaning of the phrase 'the coming of the Son of Man' in the clouds. Jesus was not referring to his return. He was alluding to Kingdom of God that would replace the four kingdoms in the vision of Daniel 7 in which Daniel saw four beasts arise from the sea. With the benefit of hindsight, we can easily identify these kingdoms as 1) Babylon, 2) Media-Persia, 3) Greece, and 4) Rome. The fourth beast was in power during Jesus' ministry. The claim of Jesus to be Lord and Savior was a direct affront to Caesar who laid claim to the same titles and demanded worship in the first century.

When Jesus told his disciples that they would then see the 'Son of Man' coming in the clouds he was alluding to the vision of Daniel 7. Jesus had claimed the be ushering in the Kingdom of God. The destruction of the temple would be a very public sign that would vindicate these claims and the claims of the disciples. Jesus further claimed that ll these events would take place within 'this generation'. Again, we must keep in mind that Jesus was speaking to his disciples in answer to their question of when the temple would be destroyed.

Just as Jesus predicted, in 70 AD Titus led the Roman army in a siege against Jerusalem. The residents were starved, the city burned, and the temple torn down to its foundation. The ancient historian Josephus provides a blow by blow description in his work 'The Wars of the Jews'. This event was the culmination of the 'tribulation' predicted by Jesus. He further told his disciples that, when this happened, the angels of God would gather the elect from the four winds.

Suffice it to say that if you have faith in Jesus Christ, you are one of God's elect being gathered by the angels. It is safe to read yourself into that scripture. You are a fulfillment of the prophecy made by Jesus in that verse.

John 11:49 Then one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said, “You know nothing at all! 50 You do not realize that it is more to your advantage to have one man die for the people than for the whole nation to perish.” 51 (Now he did not say this on his own, but because he was high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus was going to die for the Jewish nation, 52 and not for the Jewish nation only, but to gather together into one the children of God who are scattered.)

See what I mean?

beckrl · Postby **beckrl** » January 6th, 2010, 2:33 pm

His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Are we all in heaven?

Russell Roberts · Postby **Russell Roberts** » January 6th, 2010, 2:49 pm

I am beckrl

I just had a hot apple fritter and a cup of coffee!

beckrl · Postby **beckrl** » January 8th, 2010, 2:54 pm

So for real how to you interpret that passage?

Russell Roberts · Postby **Russell Roberts** » January 8th, 2010, 3:04 pm

Beckrl, I interpret as figurative.

Here is Mark's version

Then he will send angels and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of heaven.

I think this is meant simply to indicate the extent of the gathering of God's elect.

beckrl · Postby **beckrl** » January 8th, 2010, 4:42 pm

Just curious how do you then interpret verse 30?

Not trying to put you on the spot :wink:

Russell Roberts · Postby **Russell Roberts** » January 9th, 2010, 1:41 am

Beckrl, it appears to be an editorial note by the author of John. Am I missing something?

I presume you are referring to John 11:30?

beckrl · Postby **beckrl** » January 9th, 2010, 6:33 am

Sorry, I was refering to Matthew 24:30
In which you made a comment about the elect and the four winds, I would like your view as to verse 30. Thanks

Russell Roberts · Postby **Russell Roberts** » January 9th, 2010, 6:48 am

beckrl, I'm not sure.

Josephus recorded that a star in the shape of a sword appeared over Jerusalem for about a year prior to its destruction. Maybe that is it. But I am just guessing.

beckrl · Postby **beckrl** » January 9th, 2010, 7:03 am

So you would refer that verse as being in the first century?
Then the next one refering to us as our gathering.

Suffice it to say that if you have faith in Jesus Christ, you are one of God's elect being gathered by the angels. It is safe to read yourself into that scripture. You are a fulfillment of the prophecy made by Jesus in that verse

It would seem to me that "and" in verse 31 is a conjuction of what is just read.

i'm just asking.

Russell Roberts · Postby **Russell Roberts** » January 9th, 2010, 9:55 am

Beckrl,

The Greek word kai can mean either and or then depending on the context. I'm not sure which one is appropriate here. In either case, it is a past event. The Son of Man did come. It just doesn't refer to the second coming in this case. It refers to vindication for Jesus and his disciples.

Jude 2